Bartertown Watch

[MagickalMemories]

I don't have a problem with the idea as long as it doesn't turn into a witch hunt.

That's not what it would be about. Not at all.
I think that Lin, Adam and the rest of the bunch have shown clearly just how level headed and intelligent that are about these things. They would be the ones in charge. The board and group would merely be eyes and ears, there to assist them and point out things they might not have noticed yet.
The FURTHEST their "power" (notice the quotes) would go would be to send friendly reminders to people who violate things like posting limits and stuff... nothing that most of us don't do already, anyway, as contributing members of Bartertown.

As a practical question though, what would be done about someone who simply seems suspicious? Unless it turns out to be an alias for a known scammer or someone shilling with multiple accounts (i have no idea how often either of these happens), would anything be done? i guess this is realy more a question to the mods/admins.

As you say, that is definitely a question for an admin to give an actual answer to... Of course, you've been here long enough to know that, if I have an opinion, I'll say it. LOL

Seeming suspicious is not a crime. Nothing would be done openly, I'd imagine, with someone who seems suspicious. Behind the scenes, though, the Watch could warn Admin about the behavior, and Admin could decide whether or not to look into it.
I know admin/mods are ALL on the ball. Sometimes, though, they don't see things. They can't be everywhere. They aren't omnipotent Gods... regardless of WHAT they think. (JK, guys... don't ban me for life). LOL
Take the recent Gester thing... Jones would have gotten away with another scam or three before getting figured out again, most likely, if someone (forgive me, I don't recall who) hadn't posted some info about the name that showed up on an email, and if it hadn't been confirmed by someone else.
I doubt Lin was aware of that... the Mods, either... until a regular "Joe-Member" posted the information.
That's the kind of thing *I* am seeing the Watch do.

...And let me actually SAY that, for me, it would be an honor to join that group.


Eric

[Commander_Dante]

Where Can I Sign Up ????

[MagickalMemories]

Well, it hasn't actually been created, yet.
Right now, it is all hypothetical (but many of us are hoping that will change). That decision is up to admin.

Also, if the suggestions are taken into consideration, it will likely be by invitation only.

Eric

[Brian Khazad]

Saw this thread earlier, then logged off to spend some time thinking about it on several levels. With something of this nature, ALL aspects need to be considered, the good as well as the bad. Granted in this situation, there seem to be very few 'bad' aspects. Here are some thoughts I ran into.....

1: MM, I disagree with you on one slight point - I feel the Friendly/Helpful should carry more weight than Length of membership/# of posts. if someone has been here for 5 months, has always been friendly to other posters/chatters, always willing to answer questions or give useful advice, then to me that's worth more than someone who's been here for 3 years, has a rating of 276 and doesn't do much to help others on the boards.

2: One caution: be sure to find a way to discourage an "us vs. them" attitude. If a member of the Watch ends up with a bit of ego, it would be rather easy for them to point to their membership and imply that it means they're a "better" member or more important. Their FUNCTION may be important, but that shouldn't be allowed to go to someone's head.

3: I'd recommend a codified set of behavioural guidelines - IE This is what the rules are that Watch members should follow (IE the being held to a higher standard that was listed in the other thread). This should be made public so that EVERYONE knows that they have some sort of rules to follow.

4: Keep it small. MM, you're on 7-12 hrs a week. Als is on the Chat ALL THE TIME, and probably here almost as often. There are a number of others as you've said that are here a lot. So you wouldn't need that many bodies if all of them are frequently active.

-Dwarf

[MagickalMemories]

I'm going to hack apart your post, Brian, and take it in different orders than you posted it, just for ease of typing.

#2 & 3 - -Yup. I'm with you. Abuse would equal warnings up to and including removal from the group, IMO.

#4, I agree that smaller is better... but not too small.
I may be at 7 to 12 hours... but I don't want to spend 5 hours a week being a policeman. That would increase my time online proportionately... and Im at about the max I WANT to be at already. I like smallISH to MediumISH in size. LOL

#1... I agree AND disagree. I agree that someone who's been a member a long time, regardless of rating, shouldn't automatically be included. Like you said, they should have a reputation for helpfulness and have shown by DEED and not WORD that they have an interest in seeing BTown continue to succeed.

Why I disagree is, to be brief, because someone meeting the requirements you set forth could have come on here and bided his time, growing his rep. to make himself look legit (it's happened before, just not to the extent I am describing). Then he explodes in a flurry of trades and leaves a dozen or two traders high and dry, and makes off with thousands of dollars worth of merchandise.
Turns out later that the address he was using was just a drop box location, and he can't be found there.
If that guy was a member of the Watch, he'd have that much more of a head start on us, as it would be quite possible that someone on the Watch, not realizing he was a member, would post something on the board. He would know when to cut and run.

Of course, that's just my opinion (simplified).
I don't get the final say.

Eric

[vesrian]

commenting on Brian Khazad's post:

#1: This is why i don't think there's a need for strict requirements on things like rating, post count, etc. It's not like you'd be finding members by going through all 8000+ users and seeing who meets the requirements. If it's an invitation thing, appropriate canidates will make themselves obvious by their actions.

#2: Totally agree. In all honesty though, this proposed watch doesn't seem to have any actual power to abuse. If no one makes a big deal of it, most people aren't even going to realize such a thing exists. The more over the top you go with titles and icons and such, the more potential there is for problems to arise.

#3: This is tied in with #2. I think the most critical thing is whether they could actually speak with any authority. If a mod/admin chimes in and tells me to stop doing something there's a pretty good chance i'll listen, even if i think i'm in the right, simply because they have authority here. If some random other person says the same thing it's not going to carry the same weight because, you know, who are they to tell me what to do ;). Establish where on that spectrum the "watch" lies and make sure there's no confusion about it and i suspect you'll head off a lot of problems.

[narceron]

I would have to second, or third, the opinion that more helpful members, more active members, should be chosen over people who have been here for years. I've been on bartertown for many, many years, from almost the beginning, but I don't record all my trades, I don't log in most of the time I'm here. But, honestly, I'm not that helpful of a member, I like it here, I like the people, but I'm just not as outgoing as some other members.

So for me, I'd rather have quality over quantity, if a guy has 50 posts and is helpful, I'd much rather have them than a guy with 700 posts who wants to be a mini mod,

Mini mod was the word, right, now watch? I was confused on that one. I'm sure the admin will have a great list of people from which to choose,

[MagickalMemories]

Mini-mod was just a term I coined in jest.
The group we're hoping to start would be called Bartertown Watch (unless someone in power changed the name before that).

MY issue with new users is as stated above. Fifty posts is not many. I can log that in 2 weeks. Thus, my desire for some sort of minimum membership time.
Relatively speaking, I don't care WHAT the time span is, as long as Admin finds it acceptable, I am okay with it.

...and, Narceron, since you used yourself as an example, I will too.

Narceron, for example, has been here for 3 years this July, has 238 posts and (as of right now) has a 48 rating. HE would be an "appropriate" member, where those factors are concerned. He has stated himself that he is not very helpful. This fact MIGHT be held "against him." I would disagree with that because, while he may not spend as much time "chatting"
in the forums as I do, I'd bet he could offfer some good trading and etiquette advice. Additionally, I'd bet he could spot improper posts easily.
IMO, he would be the kind of person who a membership offer would be extended to, if he seemed to have any interest or someone thought he might have interest.
Of course, he's stated that he HAS no interest, so that nullifies that point.
Still, though, he's a good candidate.

Does that make sense as to what I was referring to?

Eric

[narceron]

hmm, alright, I see your point. But in general, I'm sure you'd agree, quality over quantity.

I'm gonna drop you a pm, so we don't get too far off tangent in this post.

So is the mini mod position like a watchdog, a jury, or just assistants, I've been reading this one and I'm a little unclear,

[MagickalMemories]

Quality. It;s all about quality. Quantity would just get in each others way.

So is the mini mod position like a watchdog, a jury, or just assistants, I've been reading this one and I'm a little unclear

Watchdogs and assistants, in the way I'm thinking of them.

Eric

[sirRickles]

I'm interested. An invitation would be welcomed by me if you ever get this started.

[Artimese]

I think that this is a brilliant idea.

My concern involves the precieved power of the 'Watchmen,' however. As long as the watchmen just post to a central forum and don't do the "I'm a Watchman, so you better quit it!" crap I would love for them to exist.

Heck, I'd even be willing to be one.

Mark

[MagickalMemories]

As long as the watchmen just post to a central forum and don't do the "I'm a Watchman, so you better quit it!" crap I would love for them to exist.

Well, you know, that's a good point to bring up.
Someone who would do that is not someone who is right for the group.

ASSUMING THE GROUP WAS CREATED

While it MIGHT be considered something for the watch to do, to remind people when they're breaking forum rules and whatnot, it would NOT be appropriate for them to try to be e-bullies.

I don't even, necessarily, see that the watch would NEED to do anything like that. They're the "Watch," not the "Do."

LOL

They would function well as additional eyes and ears of Bertertown, while mods & Admin would be the mouths.

Whichever way it goes, I think the idea has a lot of potential to help organize BTown even further.
Plus, many of us have voiced interest in having an optional (don't freak out on me, people)Bartertown "membership" with fees and special gadgets and whatnot. If a Watch existed to look out for the little things (mispostsed ads, spamming the threads, etc.), there would (hopefully) be more time for "the powers that be" to work on those things.

Eric

[orcdom]

i just finally saw this thread, i like some of the ideas, but only a couple things, the post count would matter but not near as much as trade refs.

trade refs cover all forms of the person themselves
and post count may show you have been helpfull, it just shows you have time to spend here and that your a blabbermouth as well (looks like i fit in this category as well).

as far as the ego inflation problem goes, i think people asking to be a member of an invitation only group should be the ones looked at not to invite right off the bat.

narceron and darksoul both have proven themselves that this is the right way to go in my opinion.

both have been here a while, trade refs between the 2 range from ok to great, and both admit they arent that helpfull, but then again if they werent that help full they wouldnt have posted thier opinions here, would they.

the mods know who the most helpfull peeps are here. and really all this boils down to is a select dozen or so people here that when they are on just have a little responsibility of when they see something wrong, call someon on it through PM. and let a mod know if you think its warrented.

i think its the same thing the regulars here have been doing for a while allready.

but also the only difference is between this proposed idea and what happens now is an invitation only forum.

i know sid, lin and morlock has gotten more than 1 pm from most of us here about wrong posting practices.

Steve