Iron Warriors and Cypher

[mrrshann618]

The Iron Warriors "Chaos Lord" was called a Warsmith.
I do not have a SM codx handy but isn't there a master of the Forge entry that you can take as a HQ choice? I could have sworn there was. Then again I haven't done much more than a glance at the newest SM codex as I hate all the new Vulkan UltraMans, Vulkan Fistboys, Vulkan Myownchapter, ect...

[MagickalMemories]

Hmm. Forgot about those emails. Will get them off soon.

It's okay if you copy SOME information. Just avoid verbatim copying from the codices and you're fine.
For example, If you list ALL of the stat line but leave off the points, it's fine. Listing what you did was great.

The csm w/servoarm would be 45 points; 15 +30 for the arm. The CSM has a 9 Ld and 3+ save.
The techmarine is 50 points, has Artificer armour, the special rules of: And They Shall Know No fear, Combat Tactics, Independant Character, Blessing of the Omnissiah, Bolster Defences. Has 8Ld and 2+ save.

I don't recall Blessing of the Omnissiah, offhand. If that's what allows him to fix vehicles, then I'd fix it. If it's something else, I'd ditch it (presuming you're ading him into a CSM army, as opposed to adding him into an army of CSM models that "count as" SM.
Also, I'd ditch the rest of the red texted items. They don't meet CSM fluff (again, presuming you play them with the CSM codex). It'll be one more step towards showing your opponent that you're not trying to just make a power list and are going towards fluff. I also wouldn't use servitors. Not very chaotic.

The only other thing I'd change is to make the Techmarine fill whichever Force Org slot that the Warsmith did.. If the Warsmith was an HQ, I'd make him HQ, etc.

Eric

[kturock]

The Iron Warriors "Chaos Lord" was called a Warsmith.
I do not have a SM codx handy but isn't there a master of the Forge entry that you can take as a HQ choice? I could have sworn there was. Then again I haven't done much more than a glance at the newest SM codex as I hate all the new Vulkan UltraMans, Vulkan Fistboys, Vulkan Myownchapter, ect...

Master of the forge is a 'super' techmarine. He's an HQ choice. The techmarine is an elite.

i've scanned it quickly. Don't see the vulkans.

[MagickalMemories]

Vulkan He'Stan. It's a special character.

Eric

P.S. Emails sent.

[kturock]

Hmm. Forgot about those emails. Will get them off soon.

It's okay if you copy SOME information. Just avoid verbatim copying from the codices and you're fine.
For example, If you list ALL of the stat line but leave off the points, it's fine. Listing what you did was great.

The csm w/servoarm would be 45 points; 15 +30 for the arm. The CSM has a 9 Ld and 3+ save.
The techmarine is 50 points, has Artificer armour, the special rules of: And They Shall Know No fear, Combat Tactics, Independant Character, Blessing of the Omnissiah, Bolster Defences. Has 8Ld and 2+ save.

I don't recall Blessing of the Omnissiah, offhand. If that's what allows him to fix vehicles, then I'd fix it. If it's something else, I'd ditch it (presuming you're ading him into a CSM army, as opposed to adding him into an army of CSM models that "count as" SM.
Also, I'd ditch the rest of the red texted items. They don't meet CSM fluff (again, presuming you play them with the CSM codex). It'll be one more step towards showing your opponent that you're not trying to just make a power list and are going towards fluff. I also wouldn't use servitors. Not very chaotic.

The only other thing I'd change is to make the Techmarine fill whichever Force Org slot that the Warsmith did.. If the Warsmith was an HQ, I'd make him HQ, etc.

Eric

I was going to list the stat line and points, also the skills, but then, that's listing everything. So I listed almost none of it.

Blessing is the repair roll, 5-6 on d6. I'd change the name but that's it.
I said I was going to ditch the skills [red] since I wanted to field a unit, then later and army of IW.
My original thoughts were to make him a csm with a servo arm for +30 points. It'd give the repair roll and a powerfist. A power weapon costs 15 points per the csm wargear. So for 15 points, he'd gain the posibility to repair.

I don't see the warsmith listed in the 4th or 5th ed. csm codexes. So maybe he's just a asp. champ. The only reference to a warsmith in 5th ed is on page 68. It shows a 'warsmith' and squad. There's 8 infantry, 1 dread, a pred and a land raider.
The servo arm is listed in the 4th ed. csm codex. It's 30 points and gives a repair roll of 6 on d6, which was the same as a sm techmarine. Under the new 5th ed. sm codex, the techmarine repairs on 5-6 on d6. He comes with a servo arm and is 50 points, 5 points more than the basic csm + servo arm.

I have a warsmith mini and I'm converting an old techmarine to csm.
I decided to keep my remaining csm minis since I wasn't able to sell them. I'll keep or trade for just csm and chaos deamons.

Like I said in several other posts; I like the fiction of the GW worlds, but not the rules; well 40k rules. Whfb rules, except for the changes in magic, haven't changed in any editions.


That brings up another rules question. land raiders and rhinos can only carry 10 models each. The LR can carry 5 termies. I thought, way back when, the rhino had less room than the LR; either 5 in the rhino and 10 in the LR or 10 in the rhino and 20 in the LR.
I'll have to dig through my old books, maybe it was from 2nd ed. way back when.

[MagickalMemories]

Without looking at it... I thought the basic LR could hold 12?

The main capacity difference between the Rhino and LR is that the Rhino can NOT carry Terminators at all. Nothing in Terminator Armor.

Eric

[Ironhide]

C:SM Land Raider has troop capacity of 12. SW Land Raider has 10.

[kturock]

CSM codex, page 101, Chaos Land Raider: Transport: Ten models., Models in Terminator armour count as two models.

SM codex. LR and LR redeemer 12 models pages 81 & 83. LR crusader 16 models page 82. Models in Terminator armour count as two models.

[EZ mac]

I dont have the book anymore but I remember the warsmith was in the iron warrior section in the back of the book. I believe it was a loard upgrade (like the chaplain /dark apostle)

[kturock]

I dont have the book anymore but I remember the warsmith was in the iron warrior section in the back of the book. I believe it was a loard upgrade (like the chaplain /dark apostle)

Dude, where?

I just went through 3rd ed., 4th ed., and 5th ed. codexes. Page by page and only the 4th ed. has anything for rules, and it deosn't say anything about warsmiths.

Thre are painting articles or pics of painted IW, but nothing about warsmiths.

[EZ mac]

I thought it was in the back... There probubly wasn't any real rules for him just a "add a servo a to a loard for X points" kind of thing. It might just be left over fluff but I could have sworn it was there.

[kturock]

4th ed., in the middle of the book, where they describe the defferent legions, in the 'Books of Chaos', there is a 1 page about IW. It has the bkurb that I posted earlier, +30 points for a servo arm. It also states that that IW can't have deamons, have the siege specialist skill, have no limit on use of obilts, have extra heavy support for 2 fast attack slots and can use 1 basilisk and 1 vindicator as heavy weapon slots.

That was the basis of part of my question about how to use/create the IW and techmarine for 5th ed.

[EZ mac]

Why don't u just do a chaotic version of the iron hands? Absolutely noone would have a problem seeing that on the board.

The only mini that u can't write off would be a defiler but I bet u you could do some kind of conversion on one to turn it into a iron clad dred.

[kturock]

Well, that's sorta what the IW are, no?

I'll just use the IW as vanilla csm, and make the warsmith an aspiring champ, until if/when GW releases a chaos supplement; or in 3 years, 40k 6th ed. is released and everything changes again. I've decided to keep and collect just chaos; csm and deamons. I'm not sure if I'll keep anything for whfb. Maybe the deamons if/when I get some. I still have some skaven, but not enough core to field.

Chaos has gone from legions to stray groups of renegades. Sort of like they did with whfb.

Well at least an all deamon army is legal. It might not be the be all end all, which might not be a bad thing. Unusual, since the newest codex is usually the hottest new army with new minis, and special rules. [and usually cheese]

Well, thanks for all the help all.

[kturock]

I was just cruising the GW site, for some inspiration for a deamon prince I'm making and guess what I saw? Stats and wargear.
Well I went and checked the listing for the warsmith, low and behold, there were his stats. Everything except his points cost.

Chaos Space Marine Iron Warriors Warsmith
With their skills at fighting sieges, the Iron Warriors Warsmiths are amongst the greatest tacticians in the galaxy. They are technically gifted and have the equipment to accompany their skills. Only Iron warriors armies may include a Warsmith as its Chaos Lord.
This set contains 1 metal Iron Warriors Warsmith.
Availability: Usually ships within 24 hours.
Part Code: 99060102066
With this box set you can make the following:
Chaos Lord

That was cut and pasted straight from the site. They have the full stat line, but I didn't want to post all of it. The wargear and stat line is exactly the same as a Choas Lord.
So the warsmith has been explained, but not who can get the servo arm or the cost.

Oh well, so close....


The deamon lord I'm converting is a PP Hordes Circle Warbeast.

ANother question, what size base do monsterous creatures have? The one it's on is 50mm. I know GW has 60mm also.