Ork footslogger army? Can it work??

[Norseman]

I am just going from memory here but FNP is only nullified by Power weapons, Instant death, AP1 and AP2 Weapons. I don't think it has anything to do with the armor save. It's a common misconception that if it penetrates your armor it kills your FNP.

It is just how tough you are.

Edit: Maybe not even instant death... I remember Nob bikers getting a FNP save from my LR Battle Cannons.

[porkuslime]

MM is... Wrong..

quoting the Little Black Book...
-----------------------------
Some warriors are so blood-frenzied or tough that they
can ignore injuries that would incapacitate even a
battle-hardened Space Marine. If a model with this
ability suffers an unsaved wound, roll a dice. On a 1, 2
or 3, take the wound as normal (removing the model if
it loses its final Wound). On a 4, 5 or 6, the injury is
ignored and the model continues fighting. This ability
cannot be used against wounds from weapons that
inflict instant death (by having a high enough Strength
or a special rule to that effect; even if the model is an
eternal warrior). Neither can it be used against wounds
from AP1 and AP2 weapons, power weapons and any
other wound against which no armour save can ever be
taken (like wounds from power fists, Dreadnought close
combat weapons, rending weapons that roll a 6, Perils
of the Warp, failed Dangerous terrain tests, etc).

--------

[Norseman]

See MM your Orks are even tougher than you thought.

The Mad Dok in with the 30 boys is insanely hard to kill.

One time I got so upset I charged it with my command squad (to get rid of the FNP save so i could shoot them to death after) with a sactioned psycher with a force weapon & commissar. I moved my SP into base contact with the Mad doc and then proceeded to hit him with every attack. I cheered. The SP then proceeded to fail his psychic test and was summerly executed. Needless to say I never ran that combo again.

[MagickalMemories]

This ability
cannot be used against wounds from weapons that
inflict instant death (by having a high enough Strength
or a special rule to that effect; even if the model is an
eternal warrior). Neither can it be used against wounds
from AP1 and AP2 weapons, power weapons and any
other wound against which no armour save can ever be
taken (like wounds from power fists, Dreadnought close
combat weapons, rending weapons that roll a 6, Perils
of the Warp, failed Dangerous terrain tests, etc).

I appreciate what you went through to type all that (unless you have it on pdf or something, then pbbbblllt), but the above quote is where the problem is. Note the emboldened text.

An ork can NEVER take an armor save from any weapon with an AP value greater than its armor save. Although it's not specifically mentioned, it could easily be determined to fall under "etc."

Q) Can an Ork boy take an armor save against a bolter?
A) No.
Q) Never?
A) Never ever.


Don't get me wrong... I'd LIKE it to work like that. As Orks are the new current flavor for me, I would greatly benefit from it. I'm just not convinced.

Eric

[porkuslime]

Look at it this way.. basic Bolter.. can a Marine take an armor save vs it? Yes. Therefore ALL Bolter shots can be FNPed by Orks. Lascannons? Nope... therefore the AP2 clause comes in.. What about basic Chainsword vs a Necron? Yep.. armor save can be made.. thus FNP on Orks would work.

The issue is the phrase " any other wound against which no armour save can ever be taken"..

I read it as " any other wound against which no armour save can ever be taken"

and I see you reading it otherwise... " any other wound against which no armour save can ever be taken"

[Norseman]

Yeah what he said...

This is actually where a Rules as Written, actually makes sense. It's tough but not game unbalancing.

That (EVER) word is to "all encompass" all of those things that that happen in the game that say, "Take a wound with no armor saves allowed".

[getupandgo]

It specifies AP 1 and 2 weapons as denying FNP, in regards to:

...and any other wound against which no armour save can ever be taken

it is explained clearly, if you read the rest of the paragraph:

(like wounds from power fists, Dreadnought close combat weapons, rending weapons that roll a 6, Perils of the Warp, failed Dangerous terrain tests, etc)

The "etc" is why is reads the way it does, because armies may have other ways to cause or get wounds that do not allow an armor save.. The AP aspect was already laid out (only AP 1 or AP 2 deny FNP).

Orks with a 6 armor save, WOULD get FNP against AP3, AP4, AP5, and AP6 weapons that did not instakill them, or fall into one of the other categories that deny FNP (rending, etc)