Searching is currently broken.

We're aware that most searches result in a 504 Gateway Timeout error.

We are currently working with our host and the phpBB community to find a fix. Follow along, here.

We apologize for the inconvenience this causes many of you, and we will update the thread linked when we have more information.

Thanks,
Plarz

Deadbeat: Cyx

They're not Bad Traders per se but they are REALLY annoying. Tell us about them here. READ THE RULES.

Moderator: Moderators

Siegebeast2142 ( 52 )
Journeyman Trader
Posts: 153
Joined: Tue Feb 19, 2013 8:41 pm
Location: Washington

Deadbeat: Cyx

Post by Siegebeast2142 » Tue Apr 14, 2015 4:28 am

Hey everyone, just thought I'd throw out a warning about Cyx. We had agreed to a trade, he didn't inform me of problems with the models, and a model was missing from what we had agreed to trade, and when I confronted him about it, his resolution was "send the models back, I don't want to deal with you."
Daemons
Sent: Sun Mar 29, 2015 1:23 am
by Siegebeast2142

I have a tomb kings battalion box, it's an older one that comes with bows for the skeletons. It's nib except for 1 skeleton I assembled as an archer. I'd like to trade it for Be'lakor, the Khorne Herald on Juggernaut, and the flesh hounds.
Re: Daemons
Sent: Sun Mar 29, 2015 8:06 am
by Cyx

Hello,

I am interested in the battalion box. But do you happen to have anything else for trade, or want the other daemons? Mostly just trying to get rid of them as lots like I mentioned in the post.
Re: Daemons
Sent: Sun Mar 29, 2015 11:08 am
by Siegebeast2142

Oh, I didn't see that sorry. I just did I quick search. I play the khorne daemon in codex, so I don't even have the option to use any of the other daemons. If you are willing to break apart all of the khorne models and be'lakor, which would be skull taker and karanak ($44.50), I don't have anything else on your wants list, but i'd be willing to throw in about $20 depending on condition.
Re: Daemons
Sent: Sun Mar 29, 2015 11:18 am
by Siegebeast2142

actually, karanak can't be taken in the khorne daemonkin codex, so I'd only be interested in skull taker. If you'd be willing to part out, I could throw in $10 for skull taker.
Re: Daemons
Sent: Sun Mar 29, 2015 12:57 pm
by Siegebeast2142

How much cash for the entire lot then, including the tomb kings box?
Re: Daemons
Sent: Sun Mar 29, 2015 11:52 am
by Cyx

Yeah, I don't want to part out man, sorry. Thank you though.
Re: Daemons
Sent: Sun Mar 29, 2015 3:18 pm
by Cyx

So it's the older one, but still has the 40 warriors, 3 chariots, and 8 horsemen right?

Retail for what I have is
$80 for the grinder
60 for the hounds
50 juggernaught
35 ddaemonettes
30 karanak
30 skull taker
30 fiend
30 beast
19 masque
Can't find belabor on the website but I'd say 50 since he's a bigger model

So maybe ~414 retail, and even though battalion box is older Id say it's 125 retail. I'm mostly trying to get rid of this stuff too, so I'd say the box + $140 which is less than 50% retail
Re: Daemons
Sent: Sun Mar 29, 2015 3:33 pm
by Siegebeast2142

The box says it comes with 32 Skeleton Warriors armed with bows, spears, or hand weapon and shield, 3 skeleton chariots and 8 skeleton horsemen w/bows or spears and shields.

Be'lakor is $38 http://www.games-workshop.com/en-US/sea ... be%27lakor

Soul Grinder is $66 http://www.games-workshop.com/en-US/sea ... ul+grinder

Karanak and Skull Taker are $22.25 each http://www.games-workshop.com/en-US/Cha ... ns-Karanak & http://www.games-workshop.com/en-US/Cha ... Skulltaker

Masque is $16, but that's not as far off as the others http://www.games-workshop.com/en-US/Cha ... The-Masque

Beast is $25 http://www.games-workshop.com/en-US/Cha ... -of-Nurgle

Deamonettes are $30 http://www.games-workshop.com/en-US/Cha ... f-Slaanesh

Herald on Juggernaut is $40 http://www.games-workshop.com/en-US/Cha ... -of-Khorne

Fiend is $25 http://www.games-workshop.com/en-US/Cha ... nesh-1-40K

Hounds are $50 http://www.games-workshop.com/en-US/Cha ... -of-Khorne

Depending on how the pictures look, I could be okay with throwing in $100.
Re: Daemons
Sent: Sun Mar 29, 2015 3:34 pm
by Siegebeast2142

Could you send pictures to hookerc@usa.com please?
Re: Daemons
Sent: Sun Mar 29, 2015 3:50 pm
by Cyx

Sent the pics, not sure why it was off so much. I swear it said those next to them on the site.

Any way here are the pics again
d1.jpg
d2.jpg
d3.jpg
d4.jpg
d5.jpg
More Pictures in first comment
Re: Daemons
Sent: Sun Mar 29, 2015 3:56 pm
by Siegebeast2142

Yea, that looks fine. does $100 with the battalion box sound acceptable?
Sent: Sun Mar 29, 2015 4:06 pm
by Cyx

I like to barter and haggle a bit, so please don't be offended.

But since it's the older battalion box, how about $110, and you pay shipping. But I'll ship first without anything due to the lower rating.
Re: Daemons
Sent: Sun Mar 29, 2015 4:28 pm
by Siegebeast2142

I can do $105, which gets us exactly to 50% retail, better than your original percentile offer. But I can not pay shipping for both of us. You pay yours, I'll pay mine, and I'll send the $105 inside of the battalion box in a small envelope.
Sent: Sun Mar 29, 2015 4:35 pm
by Cyx

Alright, deal then if you're in the US.

Will try to get it out next week after work. USPS closes at 5 and I get off at 4, so I'll have to see if I can get out early one day.
Re: Daemons
Sent: Sun Mar 29, 2015 4:41 pm
by Siegebeast2142

Sounds good!

Shipping enough:

CJ Hooker
3014 N Willow RD
Spokane Valley, WA 99206

yours? I'll get everything packaged up and ready to ship out.
Re: Daemons
Sent: Sun Mar 29, 2015 5:38 pm
by Cyx

Thanks man

Charles miller
9383 sparks way
Sacramento ca 95827
Re: Daemons
Sent: Mon Mar 30, 2015 6:08 pm
by Cyx

Hey, just an update. I forgt I get tomorrow off as a holiday, so I'll likely be shipping tomorrow.
Re: Daemons
Sent: Mon Mar 30, 2015 6:08 pm
by Siegebeast2142

Awesome, thanks for letting me know!
Re: Daemons
Sent: Mon Mar 30, 2015 6:12 pm
by Cyx

No problem, man. Figured I would keep you apprised.
Re: Daemons
Sent: Tue Mar 31, 2015 1:07 pm
by Cyx

Arrival says monday 4/6

Tracking # 9534 6110 9901 5090 5052 71
Re: Daemons
Sent: Sat Apr 04, 2015 10:46 pm
by Siegebeast2142

Hey, I got the models today. They all arrived pretty well. My biggest problem with them though is that the metal models were put together with green stuff in the sockets. The beast, the heralds, and be'lakor are all put together like that. That's $125 of the models. Instead of 50% retail for them, I'd be fine paying 25% retail for them, or sending them back. I wish you had mentioned the green stuff fillings :( So instead of 105, I'd be sending $50.
Re: Daemons
Sent: Sat Apr 04, 2015 10:47 pm
by Siegebeast2142

The other option I'd like to propose is not sending any money, and shipping back Karanak, the herald on the juggernaut, the beast, masque and daemonettes with the tomb kings, and calling htat a fair trade.
Re: Daemons
Sent: Sun Apr 05, 2015 8:25 am
by Siegebeast2142

I was looking at pictures on GW's site, and I noticed that the model that I thought was the herald on Juggernaut was a Fiend of Slannesh. There is no herald on juggernaut model.

The other option I'd like to propose is not sending any money, and shipping back Karanak, the fiend, the beast, masque and daemonettes with the tomb kings, and calling that a fair trade. That's $126 of models for 125 in the battle box.
Re: Daemons
Sent: Sun Apr 05, 2015 8:50 am
by Cyx

This is the newest model as they just came out with new stuff as I'm sure you know.
http://www.games-workshop.com/en-US/Cha ... id=2965668

There was a fiend of slaanesh AND the Khorne herald on juggernaught. Further, I don't remotely consider the green stuff that much of a problem, and while I didn't mention it I didn't think I had to. If it was that much of a problem (25% worth) then you should have explicitly asked.

Just send the entire package back.
This is where he decides to cancel the deal. Remember earlier he said that he "likes to barter," and instead of doing that, just cancels the trade. What follows is mostly just a bunch of me trying to salvage a deal that we could both be happy with, with a bunch of circles.
Re: Daemons
Sent: Sun Apr 05, 2015 9:55 am
by Cyx

In addition, I expect them to be packed the same way I packed them and in the mail by the end of tuesday. I feel this is an adequate amount of time, if there is something pressing preventing you from doing this, let me know now. And I double bubble wrapped eveeything and added a second layer of large bubble wrap on top. Nothing should be broken or bent whatsoever
Re: Daemons
Sent: Sun Apr 05, 2015 11:56 am
by Siegebeast2142

I'll send you pictures of how I got the models, Karanak has his two extra heads broken off, and the fiend fell apart in transit. Like I said, I'll take pictures. One wing and the hand with the ax fell off be'lakor, but I've glued those back on.

The only reason why it's a big problem is because of how sloppiply it was done, and how many points that costs in a paint score. When you have green/blue stuff bulging out of the gaps where pieces glue together, that isn't nice or professional looking. When models have defects like that, it is on the person who has them to mention them, not the person getting them to ask about it. People would have thousand word PM's asking about all the different things about the model they want, instead of the person getting rid of them saying everything they deviated from with standard assembling.

Now, to make sure that I understand you right, you want to completely cancel the trade, instead of accepting one of the other offers I mentioned, correct? Instead of getting the tomb kings and most of your models back, you just want all of your models back?
Re: Daemons
Sent: Sun Apr 05, 2015 12:15 pm
by Cyx

Thank you, pictures will be fine.

And I completely understand that, I got these second hand. If I were to keep them rather than get rid of them I would have just removed the green stuff when I noticed it. Also, they're not even primed, even with the green stuff 50% is more than fair. Of course you could find better deals, but that's even more on the cheap side from my experience asking about prices on this site.

It's on me that I didn't inspect them that well, but as bad as it is, the pictures would have shown that as well. I'm willing to work with you, but certainly not dropping 1/4 of the trade simply because of some green stuff that you can fix in less than an hour or two.

Yes, I only want to get rid off all of this at once. Which is why the stuff that was paid cash for was 50% retail. If I just got some of them back then I would still have to spend more time trying to find someone who wants them.

I'd be willing to accept the battalion box and $90, but nothing less. That's about 42% retail which is more than fair for bare metal assembled pieces that haven't been so much as primed.

Otherwise I'm willing to pay half of shipping ($4.5 since I paid $9) to send it back.

Also, were you saying that you didn't receive the khorn herald on juggernaught? Because that was most definitely sent with everything else.
Re: Daemons
Sent: Sun Apr 05, 2015 12:28 pm
by Siegebeast2142

Correct, there is NO herald of Khorne on a juggernaut. The model that I thought was the herald was a Fiend of Slannesh. That was the only thing missing from the box. With the missing herald, and the few hours of extra work to remove superglued green stuff, and keeping all of the models, I'd be willing to send you no more than $65.
Re: Daemons
Sent: Sun Apr 05, 2015 12:56 pm
by Cyx

That's highly unlikely in my opinion. I'm 100% confident that the herald was included. It's a bloodletter riding a juggernaught. It was in the box when shipped. I'm not going to short anyone anything, that's ridiculous. Everything in the pictures INCLUDING the herald was shipped in the box.
Re: Daemons
Sent: Sun Apr 05, 2015 12:59 pm
by Cyx

Just to make it perfectly clear, this is the pictre I orginally sent as well. That model on the right of the bloodletter riding a juggernaught wasn't in the box?

Image of Khorne Herald riding juggernaut is suppose to be here
Re: Daemons
Sent: Sun Apr 05, 2015 1:24 pm
by Siegebeast2142

Correct. That models was not in the box. All of metal parts that broke off of pieces have been assigned to the model they came from. There wasn't even a left over bloodletter sword in the box or anything.
Re: Daemons
Sent: Sun Apr 05, 2015 1:27 pm
by Cyx

Then we have a problem, because it was most certainly included in the box. I don't have so much as a single daemon bit as that was the last of it. I remember the items I put bubble wrap around, and that was definitely one of them. When I get home I will go through wverything thoroughly despite the fact I'm damn sure it was included.

How was the box when you received it and did you take pictures when you opened it?
Re: Daemons
Sent: Sun Apr 05, 2015 1:49 pm
by Siegebeast2142

The box had one piece of tape in the middle of both side flaps on the bottom. No, I didn't take any pictures of it before I opened it.
Sent: Sun Apr 05, 2015 1:53 pm
by Cyx

I am NOT accusing you whatsoever. But to be perfectly honest I think it's more likely that someone would want a free model than usps opening and taking a model out.

Take this as acknowledgement that I'm filing a claim with usps and using your posts as affirmation of non receipt.

And it should have had one across the top and 2 across horizontally.
Re: Daemons
Sent: Sun Apr 05, 2015 4:06 pm
by Siegebeast2142

From my point of view, it's much more likely that someone mispacked than USPS took a free model. Regardless, shall I send $65 and the Battallion box out on Monday to fulfill my end of the trade?
Re: Daemons
Sent: Sun Apr 05, 2015 4:11 pm
by Cyx

Please hold off and let me contact usps tomorrow to see what they would prefer we do. But I am not comfortable with just receiving $65 and the battalion box for what I sent you.

And I completely agree I would as well if I was in your shoes. Which is why I said I wasn't accusing you, as there's no evidence one way or the other yet.
Re: Daemons
Sent: Mon Apr 06, 2015 6:48 am
by Cyx

Please take pictures of everything you received, including pictures of all sides of the box.
Re: Daemons
Sent: Mon Apr 06, 2015 10:32 am
by Cyx

After taking pictures of the box, please send it back to me via USPS with a signature required. Just use the bubble wrap that was already included to protect the models, please.
Re: Daemons
Sent: Mon Apr 06, 2015 12:33 pm
by Siegebeast2142

So you are cancelling the trade?
Re: Daemons
Sent: Mon Apr 06, 2015 12:33 pm
by Siegebeast2142

So you are cancelling the trade?
Re: Daemons
Sent: Mon Apr 06, 2015 3:00 pm
by Cyx

No, if you would like to send me 90$ (-$15 for the green stuff) and the battalion box for what I sent (Daemonettes, karanak, hounds, herald, masque, belakor, soulgrinder, fiend, and beast) then please go ahead.

If not, then please send ALL of my models back via usps with signature.
Re: Daemons
Sent: Mon Apr 06, 2015 3:02 pm
by Cyx

And skulltaker, I forgot him off of the list I just sent.
Re: Daemons
Sent: Mon Apr 06, 2015 3:09 pm
by Cyx

In addition, you havent acknowledged my request of pictures of the box and contents you received.

If you truly did not receive a model then it's imperative you do this.
Re: Daemons
Sent: Mon Apr 06, 2015 3:48 pm
by Siegebeast2142

My time is more valuable than than $5 an hour for just the active repairs. On top of that, I have to get high grade stripper in order to be able to even remove the green stuff. $65 is more than fair, especially considering the missing $40 model.
Re: Daemons
Sent: Mon Apr 06, 2015 3:50 pm
by Siegebeast2142

Without divulging things in my personal life that I rather not share with someone as hostile as you, I will get you the pictures as promptly as I can.
Re: Daemons
Sent: Mon Apr 06, 2015 3:53 pm
by Cyx

The $40 model would mean subtracting $20 from the trade. And you don't need that, work smarter not harder. Can be done with a file or ordinary modeling knife/tool. That's beside the point though, i obviously have a huge problem with this because I sent you something that you're saying you didn't receive.

If you happen to have "found" the other model and what to do the original trade of $105 or $90 and the tomb Kings battalion box then that's fine.

Otherwise I'm not getting what we agreed on and what I sent out.

And still I ask, please send pictures of the box as you received it.
Re: Daemons
Sent: Mon Apr 06, 2015 3:55 pm
by Cyx

I think hostile is definitely an exaggeration. Aggressive maybe considering either way I'm likely out a model, regardless of the reason.

But thank you nonetheless
Re: Daemons
Sent: Mon Apr 06, 2015 3:56 pm
by Siegebeast2142

Also, should you insist on anything more than $65, and have me send your models back, I'll need $15 sent by PayPal to ship your models back to you priority flat rate with signature confirmation, as you requested. This is non negotiable. You failed to mention a defect with your models which put us in this situation, and by telling me to send them back, you aren't reasonably trying to salvage this. I'm not taking any sort of monetary hit on a mistake YOU made.
Re: Daemons
Sent: Mon Apr 06, 2015 4:27 pm
by Cyx

First, let's get this straight. The issue is that a model is missing, not the green stuff. I'm more than willing to work around that with you. Because as you pointed out it is my fault for not disclosing it. I didn't carefully inspect the items but I still supplied pictures. If it was this big of an issue then you most certainly should have inquired about the green stuff on the belakor model that's quite obvious in the picture (after having now gone back to look at how "bad" the green stuff was several times). Something accidentally not being mentioned is not a big issue. Missing an entire ~$50 model is.

I will absolutely not take a $35 hit ($90 to $65) and lose my model that I know for a fact II sent. I had it with the other models and distinctly remember each item I packed since it wasn't very many any way. 42% for those models is MORE than fair regardless of any green stuff issue outside of converting thing (which none of the models had).. I have tried to salvage this, but I refuse to not get what I'm owed when I held up my side and sent every model we agreed upon.

First, please provide pictures of the box when you can
Then, let me know when you'll be at usps and get an estimate of the price and send me a picture of the print out. I will PayPal you the money then and there. Or take a picture of the receipt and I'll send you that exact amount.
Re: Daemons
Sent: Mon Apr 06, 2015 4:45 pm
by Siegebeast2142

After doing some math, the $65 I'm asking for is only $5 less than what you say I should pay. You said you would deduct $15 for the green stuff, and the missing model is $20 (after the 50% reduction). Added together that is $35. $105-$35=$70. Since this is what you have offered anyways, is $70 okay with you? If not, then I'll send the models back at your expense. Pictures of box/received items coming shortly.

Secondly, read bartertown rules. It is on YOU to tell ME about the status of your models, what condition they are in, and any defects. It is not on ME to ask YOU.
Re: Daemons
Sent: Mon Apr 06, 2015 4:36 pm
by Cyx

Excuse me, $25 hit, not $35. Was typingtoo quickly.
Sent: Mon Apr 06, 2015 4:55 pm
by Cyx

I did, I told you that they were assembled and bare metal. And then supplied pictures that were more than sufficient for figuring out if they interested you. Either of us could have helped the situation. I, by being more thorough. Or you, by asking for more pictures at any point or if green stuff was used.

No where in the link from the "bartertown rules" thread does it edplicitly state I'm required to say that green stuff is present. They were not converted, and you're right I should have looked closer. But this is not a big issue at all and I've been more than willing to work with you on this. Also, a pragmatic use of "defect" is incredibly subjective. It wasn't defective (or its defective as soon as it's off the sprue), it had some green stuff. After looking at the pictures several time it's not even remotely as bad as you make it out to be either.

And absolutely not, it STILL doesn't account for my missing model that I sent you.
Sent: Mon Apr 06, 2015 5:01 pm
by Cyx

Chazzy77@gmail.com

Or you could just use the forum tools to post the links here.

Or you could use an image hosting site that gives you the formatted links for forums
Re: Daemons
Sent: Mon Apr 06, 2015 4:59 pm
by Siegebeast2142

I'll need your email address to send you pictures.
Re: Daemons
Sent: Mon Apr 06, 2015 5:03 pm
by Siegebeast2142

Any sort of green stuff spilling out from assembly points is "defective" because 1: It looks unproffessional 2: It subtracts waaaay too many points in any sort of competitive tournament where painting is not only a requirement, but part of your overall score 3: It says you are required to fully describe your models. Not mentioning something is effectively the same as saying it isn't there.

Now, about this issue with what I'm sending you back. Are you willing to take $70 and the battalion box?
Re: Daemons
Sent: Mon Apr 06, 2015 5:04 pm
by Siegebeast2142

email sent.
Re: Daemons
Sent: Mon Apr 06, 2015 5:13 pm
by Cyx

I already said absolutely not. I'm still losing $24.25 (the model is $48.50 not $40 as you keep saying).

I will only accept the battalion box and $90. I've said this several times.

...yet it also mentions that once a deal is made it's done. It would have been on you to check or ask for more pictures at that point if you had in fact received all models. This is not a you problem, it's a problem for both of us. I'm out a $48.50 model and you have no commitment to this and no risk whatsoever except getting a better deal.

Also, if it is "spilling from assembly points", then you could see it in the pictures. I only have the pictures to reference, and it's not that bad at all. Not to mention we've been over this, I'd be willing to compensate by dropping from 105 to 90 for the time it would take to remove. (Less than an hour). By just using a pick or knife on the outside there is minimal chance to damage the model and you can remove ALL of the green stuff from sight. The only difference would be at MAX 1-2mm of extra length in some areas. Or you could unassemble the model at places and remove the green stuff all together.

That's why the models would be priced at 40-50% retail, because of that extra work.
Re: Daemons
Sent: Mon Apr 06, 2015 5:17 pm
by Siegebeast2142

http://www.games-workshop.com/en-US/Cha ... -of-Khorne

Games Workshop disagrees with you... This is my second time posting the link. I'm not going to pay for a model that I didn't receive.

Very well. I'll send your models back at your expense. $15 sent to my email address

That will cover flat rate medium box, plus the signature confirmation.
Re: Daemons
Sent: Mon Apr 06, 2015 5:17 pm
by Cyx

The pictures were inadequate. Only the last one actually showed up. I cannot view the rest as they are in a format I don't have access to. Just simply post the links to the image hosting site. If you simply wanted to embed the pictures (which it looks like you tried to do) then you could have sent them on this site. They prefer everything to be done through this site, so I'm not sure why you would prefer to use emails.
Re: Daemons
Sent: Mon Apr 06, 2015 5:20 pm
by Siegebeast2142

The files are too big to fit here. Right click on the picture and click open with windows viewer or equivalent.
Re: Daemons
Sent: Mon Apr 06, 2015 5:22 pm
by Cyx

http://www.games-workshop.com/en-CA/Cha ... of-Khorne#

For whatever reason mine keeps defaulting to Canadian.

You can get an estimate with no expense to you, take a picture and email it to me. I'm not going to send MORE items or money to someone when I have nothing to show for it.

So why would you expect me to give away a model for free?

Please send the pictures so they can actually be viewed.
Re: Daemons
Sent: Mon Apr 06, 2015 5:28 pm
by Cyx

Obviously you can do it, email the pictures as you did the last one.

I have apple software on my phone and windows on my laptop. Regardless of what I use i am unable to view the pictures.

I have downloaded them and used every type of picture viewer I have. They are not showing up.

Just post the link to the pictures. That does not require using any specific size and you can easily opt to make folders private/public on most free imaging hosting sites.
Re: Daemons
Sent: Mon Apr 06, 2015 5:31 pm
by Siegebeast2142

Then click on US, and then search for herald of Khorne. It's $40. I don't know why the hell you'd choose Canada for your location in GW's site instead of Cali, where you get your mail.

Total for flat medium box priority shipping and signature confirmation is $15:55! Good thing you had me check, I'd be out 55 cents!!!!!!!!!! ERMYGERDNERDRAAAAAAAGE!!!!!

So, after paypal fees are accounted for, I need you to send $16.32 to my paypal.
Re: Daemons
Sent: Mon Apr 06, 2015 5:59 pm
by Siegebeast2142

Resent.
Sent: Mon Apr 06, 2015 7:54 pm
by Cyx

Received

Shows 12.65 from your zip code to mine.

ImageImage showing a screen shot of him calculating shipping using flat rate, but not including signature confirmation

I'll respond tomorrow as I can't finish discussing this tonight.
Re: Daemons
Sent: Mon Apr 06, 2015 9:02 pm
by Siegebeast2142

That does not include the signature confirmation.
Re: Daemons
Sent: Tue Apr 07, 2015 7:08 am
by Cyx

Sent

Also, if you actually read what I wrote, it says it defaults to Canada. I've never set it to Canada and don't go on the website enough to be familiar with whether or not you can set a permanent country for your device. I do find it humorous that you called me hostile and then make slight insults, though. At least be upfront about it, haha.

I would rather get the amount right any way. I'd rather not have to spend more time dealing with you in the future. And since I'm "hostile", let me be more clear. Thats not a shot at your character, but the fact that I'm losing a model has made me apprehensive towards dealing with you, and trading models in general.
Re: Daemons
Sent: Tue Apr 07, 2015 7:29 am
by Siegebeast2142

You see, this is where I'm apprehensive about dealing with you, specifically. You have this weird all or nothing mentality. You expect me to pay for a model that I don't have, citing your perfect memory as proof that you did send it. You say you just want to get rid of your daemons for models you will use. Another simple answer would have been sticking to the original amount, but you buying a new herald on juggernaut and you shipping it to me. But, that would have "cost" you more than you would have "lost".
Re: Daemons
Sent: Tue Apr 07, 2015 7:58 am
by Cyx

Let me know when you have sent the box, please include everything you received in the box. And if you like, video record you actually packing up the box.


It's not "misplaced" and I don't have a "perfect memory". What I do know is what I packed, the last of the daemons I acquired. I don't have tons for miniatures stuff not do I live in a mess. I no longer have the model and I remember packing it. Therefore I can say I'm confident that it was in the box.

It's not an all or nothing mentality, it's that I'm not going to give you a discount and be shorted by an entire model.

Honestly if I can prove you didn't remove the model yourself then I'd have no problem with it whatsoever. What I can't understand is that you're fighting for models that you apparently don't want unless they're heavily discounted because of "green stuff". This has been at absolutely no cost to you other than time. With these transactions online you're bound to waste time at some point and sometimes deals don't work out. But you haven't actually had to buy or trade anything.

If I was you and really feel I was shorted a model intentionally then I wouldn't want to trade with that person, period. Hence why I'm paying over 50% retail of the model in question in shipling to get my other models back. I would rather pay that then possibly have to deal with you further and have possible problems with what you sent me.
Re: Daemons
Sent: Tue Apr 07, 2015 8:20 am
by Siegebeast2142

Honestly if I can prove you didn't remove the model yourself then I'd have no problem with it whatsoever.


If this is the way you are going to deal with this kind of problem with others *when*, not if, this happens, you aren't going to like the responses from the community. Do you have any proof that you packed the model? The fact is it is missing.
Re: Daemons
Sent: Tue Apr 07, 2015 10:17 am
by Cyx

I really don't think this is as common as you implied with your previous message, insinuating that it isn't likely but will most certainly happen again. Careless mistakes happen, this is not one of them.

By accepting a new deal I'm basically acceding that I'm at fault, and I'm not. I would most certainly rather just start from scratch. Which is the whole reason I don't mind spending the 50% retail price in shipping just to get my stuff MINUS a model back.

It's incredibly likely that I'm just SOL and won't get my model back. YOU'RE the one that's not getting the full end of the deal that we agreed on. It's on me that it's missing. I agree that the burden of proof is on me because I don't have video of me packing the box.

Either way we're just going in circles. Let me know when you've sent the box
Re: Daemons
Sent: Wed Apr 08, 2015 12:32 pm
by Siegebeast2142

Shipped. tracking number: 23121870000010374560. Signature Confirmation. I have box weight recorded, and video of me putting items in. Please make sure you note box weight when package arrives, and record yourself removing item for verification.
Re: Daemons
Sent: Wed Apr 08, 2015 6:09 am
by Cyx

Have you received the money and sent the package?
Re: Daemons
Sent: Wed Apr 08, 2015 1:08 pm
by Cyx

I most certainly will, thank you.
Re: Daemons
Sent: Mon Apr 13, 2015 6:56 pm
by Cyx

I received the package.

And I am now informing you that I started a request post in the BTR forum in order to leave a bad reference for you.

viewtopic.php?f=103&t=255481

regards,
Cyx
So not only was there a model missing from what he said he'd trade me, and not only were there globs of greenstuff used to glue metal contact points on all his models, not only did he straight up cancel the trade, but I'm the bad trader here. :shocked: :shocked: :shocked:

Consider yourself warned about dealing with him. Definitely not the most fun I've had on this site.
You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.

Siegebeast2142 ( 52 )
Journeyman Trader
Posts: 153
Joined: Tue Feb 19, 2013 8:41 pm
Location: Washington

Re: Deadbeat: Cyx

Post by Siegebeast2142 » Tue Apr 14, 2015 4:29 am

More pictures:
d6.jpg
d7.jpg
d8.jpg
d9.jpg
You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.

User avatar
s_o_r_r_o_w ( 312 )
Moderator Without Title
Posts: 2230
Joined: Fri Aug 06, 1999 12:00 pm
Location: Montreal, QC, Canada / US PO Box

Re: Deadbeat: Cyx

Post by s_o_r_r_o_w » Tue Apr 14, 2015 5:15 pm

It seems clear that this would be a BTR, not a BO, since you are unhappy with the way the actual deal went down, correct?
I am always in the market for weird and wonderful GW oddbitz and ephemera. PM me if you have something old/weird/rare.

-----
No Finecast, please.
-----
READ THE RULES!
-----
Tips on shipping to Canada
-----
Bartertown Trade Vocabulary

Siegebeast2142 ( 52 )
Journeyman Trader
Posts: 153
Joined: Tue Feb 19, 2013 8:41 pm
Location: Washington

Re: Deadbeat: Cyx

Post by Siegebeast2142 » Tue Apr 14, 2015 5:22 pm

I asked MM about it before sending the models back about whether or not it qualified as a backout, and he said that it wasn't a backout, but a dead beat. If it should be in the BTR, my apologies. I can recreate there.

User avatar
MagickalMemories ( 742 )
Lord Logorrheic!
Posts: 15203
Joined: Thu Sep 04, 2003 11:38 pm
Location: St. Louis, MO - USA

Re: Deadbeat: Cyx

Post by MagickalMemories » Tue Apr 14, 2015 5:52 pm

@Siegebeast:
1) Your assessment that, when you brought up a problem, his response was "send the models back. i don't want to deal with you" is misleading. According to the message history, that is not quite how it went down.
2) Do you have images of the horrible greenstuffing? The pics I've seen don't support that assessment.
3) How do you respond to the fact that the package he sent to you was 3ish oz heavier than the one you sent him, you reused exactly the shipping materials he did, and the initial package made it to you unharmed? That makes it APPEAR (i am NOT making accusations or passing judgement) that the model went missing on your end, rather than his or in transit.

...and for those reading (and reporting) this thread, it is a PERFECTLY legitimate report. Simply because the other trader jumped first, that does not automatically make this one retaliatory. How things move forward and what facts come to light will determine whether or not the 2 threads in question REMAIN legitimate.


Eric
Lower rating? You ship first.

Give me a sense of humor Lord. Give me the grace to see a joke.
To get some humor out of life and pass it on to other folk.


I think what this situation needs is some imagination.

"...I'm a nerd, and I'm here tonight to stand up for the rights of other nerds.” – Gilbert Lowell

Want my help with a BTR or backout? All messages sent/posted should be in CHRONOLOGICAL order. Otherwise, I just won't read it.

User avatar
MagickalMemories ( 742 )
Lord Logorrheic!
Posts: 15203
Joined: Thu Sep 04, 2003 11:38 pm
Location: St. Louis, MO - USA

Re: Deadbeat: Cyx

Post by MagickalMemories » Tue Apr 14, 2015 8:42 pm

I want to add an addendum to my previous post @ Siegebeast, in the spirit of being transparent and fully up front:

A huge portion of whether this is a valid BO report hinges on questions 2 & 3 above. With the wrong -or insufficient- information on either or both, you put the thread at risk of being removed.

Eric
Lower rating? You ship first.

Give me a sense of humor Lord. Give me the grace to see a joke.
To get some humor out of life and pass it on to other folk.


I think what this situation needs is some imagination.

"...I'm a nerd, and I'm here tonight to stand up for the rights of other nerds.” – Gilbert Lowell

Want my help with a BTR or backout? All messages sent/posted should be in CHRONOLOGICAL order. Otherwise, I just won't read it.

Siegebeast2142 ( 52 )
Journeyman Trader
Posts: 153
Joined: Tue Feb 19, 2013 8:41 pm
Location: Washington

Re: Deadbeat: Cyx

Post by Siegebeast2142 » Tue Apr 14, 2015 9:01 pm

I feel like that is how it went down, if only because he kept insisting on me paying for a model that I didn't receive. Sure, we went back and forth on the green stuff, we even came to a pseudo agreement on what would be an acceptable value of the green stuff work. But, his insistence on me paying for the model that I didn't receive kept us from being able to resolve the issue at all.

I don't have any of my own pictures for the green stuff. But, between enlarging the pictures he sent me and then some of his video, you can see the stuff I'm talking about. Be'lakor, on both his wrists, has green stuff oozing out of them. Karanak (the three headed dog) has globs of greenstuff in the sockets where the two outer heads are suppose to go. The Fiend of Slaneesh has green stuff oozing out of his legs. To the casual gamers it may not seem like much, but in competitive tournaments where painting is part of your overall score, it can mean the difference between best overall and not even making top 3. Had he mentioned that they needed cleaning, then I'd have been fine with that, and either worked out a different deal, or walked away. Had the pictures been close ups of each model with greenstuff oozing out to show that they weren't cleanly put together, I'd have either worked out a different deal, or walked away. On my initial look of his pictures, most of the green stuff is in shadows, making it hard to see without actually looking for it.

For the weight difference, he said that I shipped it back with him then less packaging material than I sent him. I'm not sure how much the leftover shipping material adds up to.

Siegebeast2142 ( 52 )
Journeyman Trader
Posts: 153
Joined: Tue Feb 19, 2013 8:41 pm
Location: Washington

Re: Deadbeat: Cyx

Post by Siegebeast2142 » Tue Apr 14, 2015 10:23 pm

One possible explanation for the weight differences could be the popped bubbles from the wrap. I'd assume none of them were popped before.

User avatar
MagickalMemories ( 742 )
Lord Logorrheic!
Posts: 15203
Joined: Thu Sep 04, 2003 11:38 pm
Location: St. Louis, MO - USA

Re: Deadbeat: Cyx

Post by MagickalMemories » Wed Apr 15, 2015 3:09 am

I looked at the pics. I don't *see* any greenstuff issues.
Note that I'm not saying they don't exist. I'm saying I don't SEE them. if you want to post some expanded photos, feel free.
Oozing greenstuff would definitely qualify as a problem.

Missing packing material weighs little. A difference in ounces on a package this small is, almost certainly, a model.
Again... I'm making NO accusations. I can't pretend to *know* what happened.

A popped bubble on bubblewrap would make no difference. I had a small piece. I weighed it. I popped about every bubble. I weighed it again. There's no weight difference at all.

Eric
Lower rating? You ship first.

Give me a sense of humor Lord. Give me the grace to see a joke.
To get some humor out of life and pass it on to other folk.


I think what this situation needs is some imagination.

"...I'm a nerd, and I'm here tonight to stand up for the rights of other nerds.” – Gilbert Lowell

Want my help with a BTR or backout? All messages sent/posted should be in CHRONOLOGICAL order. Otherwise, I just won't read it.

User avatar
s_o_r_r_o_w ( 312 )
Moderator Without Title
Posts: 2230
Joined: Fri Aug 06, 1999 12:00 pm
Location: Montreal, QC, Canada / US PO Box

Re: Deadbeat: Cyx

Post by s_o_r_r_o_w » Wed Apr 15, 2015 3:47 pm

MagickalMemories wrote: A popped bubble on bubblewrap would make no difference. I had a small piece. I weighed it. I popped about every bubble. I weighed it again. There's no weight difference at all.
Makes sense--since they're full of...air.
I am always in the market for weird and wonderful GW oddbitz and ephemera. PM me if you have something old/weird/rare.

-----
No Finecast, please.
-----
READ THE RULES!
-----
Tips on shipping to Canada
-----
Bartertown Trade Vocabulary

Cyx ( 24 )
BTown Regular
Posts: 79
Joined: Wed Jan 28, 2015 7:39 pm
Location: Sacramento, CA

Re: Deadbeat: Cyx

Post by Cyx » Wed Apr 15, 2015 4:43 pm

I am still NOT making any accusations either. I have my own opinion, but to make a definitive conclusion is something entirely different. I want to first mention that in my opinion, even if it was the most horrendous green stuff job you've ever seen, it could still be worked out.

The notes on the posts seem appropriate for a DB/BO post, since it's pointing out specific issues. I did not include it in the BTR so that whoever reads it wouldn't be biased by the notes. I only mention this because I'm going to respond to the notes.

These ARE NOT directed at Siegebeast. But simply a response/reaction to what was written in order to give my thoughts. As MM stated, there is no need to start an argument as these are differing opinions and both my and Siegebeast's opinions are not likely to change.

Observation - 4/4/15 10:47pm

First, the post from you on April 4 at 10:47pm was included in the previous message at 10:46pm, not sure why they're separate. Here is what I have...And these can of course always be checked by the mods, so don't take my word for it.
Sent: Tue Mar 31, 2015 1:07 pm
by Cyx

Arrival says monday 4/6

Tracking # 9534 6110 9901 5090 5052 71
Sent: Sat Apr 04, 2015 10:46 pm
by Siegebeast2142

Hey, I got the models today. They all arrived pretty well. My biggest problem with them though is that the metal models were put together with green stuff in the sockets. The beast, the heralds, and be'lakor are all put together like that. That's $125 of the models. Instead of 50% retail for them, I'd be fine paying 25% retail for them, or sending them back. I wish you had mentioned the green stuff fillings :( So instead of 105, I'd be sending $50.
Sent: Sun Apr 05, 2015 8:25 am
by Siegebeast2142

I was looking at pictures on GW's site, and I noticed that the model that I thought was the herald on Juggernaut was a Fiend of Slannesh. There is no herald on juggernaut model.

The other option I'd like to propose is not sending any money, and shipping back Karanak, the fiend, the beast, masque and daemonettes with the tomb kings, and calling that a fair trade. That's $126 of models for 125 in the battle box.
This is pertinent because it shows a large gap of time between you checking the shipment and when you realized/messaged me about the missing model. There are no other messages in between those. That is exactly how it shows up in my inbox.

I am NOT trying to insult whatsoever, and things slipping peoples' minds happens everyday. But when I check a shipment for accuracy (the two or three times I've done so), I make sure all the models are there. You specifically said certain models had green stuff issues (including the herald). If you checked each individual model at the joints, and therefore spent more than 5seconds looking, it seems likely that you would recognize the model. And it's entirely possible that you just mixed up the models, it happens. I just think this is odd and may require further looking into.

Red note - 4/5/15 8:50am

I am not going to lie, when something like this happens and it seems (to me) that I may be getting shafted or being taken advantage of, I get defensive and would rather just start from the beginning. Which entails going back to whatever state I was in before. In this case it was getting my models back because I knew I packed that one and all outcomes from there seemed bad for me. So I might as well try to recoup and get back to at least what I had before this happened.

In addition, most of the apprehension is because there was a missing model and there's absolutely no way we would see eye to eye as what's "fair". I knew this immediately and just opted to have Siegebeast send the stuff back. But he wanted to continue, so I obliged and told him my terms. That being, a discount on the original price for the green stuff issues. But that I'm not going to just forget about a whole model.

I believe this was not bartering/haggling. It was an attempt at altering a deal due to extenuating circumstances. In that it would be more forgivable because I'd give Siegebeast a heavy discount.

Observation

I just want to point this out, as it would have helped answer MM's question directed at Siegebeast regarding pictures of the models.
Sent: Sun Apr 05, 2015 11:56 am
by Siegebeast2142

I'll send you pictures of how I got the models, Karanak has his two extra heads broken off, and the fiend fell apart in transit. Like I said, I'll take pictures. One wing and the hand with the ax fell off be'lakor, but I've glued those back on.

The only reason why it's a big problem is because of how sloppiply it was done, and how many points that costs in a paint score. When you have green/blue stuff bulging out of the gaps where pieces glue together, that isn't nice or professional looking. When models have defects like that, it is on the person who has them to mention them, not the person getting them to ask about it. People would have thousand word PM's asking about all the different things about the model they want, instead of the person getting rid of them saying everything they deviated from with standard assembling.

Now, to make sure that I understand you right, you want to completely cancel the trade, instead of accepting one of the other offers I mentioned, correct? Instead of getting the tomb kings and most of your models back, you just want all of your models back?
Re: Daemons
Sent: Sun Apr 05, 2015 1:49 pm
by Siegebeast2142

The box had one piece of tape in the middle of both side flaps on the bottom. No, I didn't take any pictures of it before I opened it.
Re: Daemons
Sent: Sun Apr 05, 2015 1:27 pm
by Cyx

Then we have a problem, because it was most certainly included in the box. I don't have so much as a single daemon bit as that was the last of it. I remember the items I put bubble wrap around, and that was definitely one of them. When I get home I will go through wverything thoroughly despite the fact I'm damn sure it was included.

How was the box when you received it and did you take pictures when you opened it?
Sent: Mon Apr 06, 2015 6:48 am
by Cyx

Please take pictures of everything you received, including pictures of all sides of the box.
Sent: Mon Apr 06, 2015 3:09 pm
by Cyx

In addition, you havent acknowledged my request of pictures of the box and contents you received.

If you truly did not receive a model then it's imperative you do this.
Sent: Mon Apr 06, 2015 3:53 pm
by Cyx

The $40 model would mean subtracting $20 from the trade. And you don't need that, work smarter not harder. Can be done with a file or ordinary modeling knife/tool. That's beside the point though, i obviously have a huge problem with this because I sent you something that you're saying you didn't receive.

If you happen to have "found" the other model and what to do the original trade of $105 or $90 and the tomb Kings battalion box then that's fine.

Otherwise I'm not getting what we agreed on and what I sent out.

And still I ask, please send pictures of the box as you received it.
Sent: Mon Apr 06, 2015 5:13 pm
by Cyx

.....

Also, if it is "spilling from assembly points", then you could see it in the pictures. I only have the pictures to reference, and it's not that bad at all.

....
I believe I made MORE than a reasonable number of attempts to request pictures of the models/box. Which could show the bad green stuff from his point of view. If you go to the video and pause on the areas that show green stuff, you can see it in the joints, and very little actually "spilling over". It is a "lazy" way of putting the metal models together, and adds a couple mm to the overall legnth of the limb/head/etc....But I do not believe this was an egregious green stuffing issue.

I do concede that a lot of the original pictures had shadows near the joints, though. I am ignorant in regard to photography and lighting in pictures in general. This was not intentional, and I apologize.


Regarding the weight

I packed one large green bubble wrap piece, a large white piece and 5 smaller pieces. I received all but 4 of the smaller pieces back. The largest weighed 0.2oz and was 4x or more larger than the smaller pieces. Even if they were that big, that's 0.8oz. Not even remotely considering the added paper bag, that's 2.4oz unaccounted for. (2lbs 10.2oz on my receipt and 2lbs 7oz weighed at usps before it touched my hands). If you add in the paper bag (at 0.6oz), then there's 3oz missing.

In addition, as MM said, there's no way that air accounts for 2.4/3 oz. Regardless of humidity, location, temperature etc.
http://antoine.frostburg.edu/chem/senes ... -air.shtml (air = 1.19 g/L)

Mass = Density x volume

Volume of rectangle = side a x side b x side c

The box is (10.5" or 266.7mm) x (11" or 279.4mm) x (3.5" or 88.9mm)

Volume = 6624470.622 cubic mm. millimeters cubed to cubic centimeters is needed

So volume = 6624.470622 cubic cm....1000cc = 1L.
= 6.62L

6.62L x 1.19 = mass
=7.88g
=0.278oz.

So the mass of air in the ENTIRE box (not considering the displacement of the actual models etc.), would be about 0.25-0.3oz. This definitely does not account for 3oz.

Again, I'm not trying to start an argument. Just saying that I am 100% certain the discrepancy is not due to air.

Siegebeast2142 ( 52 )
Journeyman Trader
Posts: 153
Joined: Tue Feb 19, 2013 8:41 pm
Location: Washington

Re: Deadbeat: Cyx

Post by Siegebeast2142 » Wed Apr 15, 2015 6:17 pm

a1.jpg
You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.

Siegebeast2142 ( 52 )
Journeyman Trader
Posts: 153
Joined: Tue Feb 19, 2013 8:41 pm
Location: Washington

Re: Deadbeat: Cyx

Post by Siegebeast2142 » Wed Apr 15, 2015 6:24 pm

a2.png
Both Karanak heads were filled like this.
You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.

User avatar
MagickalMemories ( 742 )
Lord Logorrheic!
Posts: 15203
Joined: Thu Sep 04, 2003 11:38 pm
Location: St. Louis, MO - USA

Re: Deadbeat: Cyx

Post by MagickalMemories » Wed Apr 15, 2015 8:34 pm

Here are the problems with those 2 pics... On Be'lakor (or whatever), the right wrist and waist look fine in that pic. It's not uncommon to be able to see GS in gaps or for there to be some green coloration to the metal after smoothing out. What particular pic doesn't show anything bad to me on the waist and right wrist.
The LEFT wrist looks like there COULD be a problem but, without you having taken a picture of it on your own from a different angle, I just can't be sure. I can see green, sure. But I can't see that it's excessive.
As for the second picture; I can't even tell what it's a picture of or what I'm supposed to be seeing, man.

Eric
Lower rating? You ship first.

Give me a sense of humor Lord. Give me the grace to see a joke.
To get some humor out of life and pass it on to other folk.


I think what this situation needs is some imagination.

"...I'm a nerd, and I'm here tonight to stand up for the rights of other nerds.” – Gilbert Lowell

Want my help with a BTR or backout? All messages sent/posted should be in CHRONOLOGICAL order. Otherwise, I just won't read it.

Siegebeast2142 ( 52 )
Journeyman Trader
Posts: 153
Joined: Tue Feb 19, 2013 8:41 pm
Location: Washington

Re: Deadbeat: Cyx

Post by Siegebeast2142 » Wed Apr 15, 2015 11:53 pm

That second picture is where one of karanaks 3 heads are suppose to go.

Post Reply

Return to “Deadbeats & Backouts”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 3 guests