Underhanded at Bartertown Again

[PierceC]

I guess I am a sucker for punishment...the main reason that I don't use Bartertown is that everytime I try to get in a deal, that someone undercuts you. Maybe it's just the traders at Bartertown, but if you don't get to the magical "exchange addresses" barrier it's fine to drop everything and get on a new horse.

All I can say is I'm glad there are other trading websites where people have a few more morals and will see a trade through if they have started to deal. I guess that's why we have the magical trade barrier or else everybody would be considered a backout, but there would be loads of good feedback given out.

Thanks for your re-assurance once again Batertown, you really are second best

[Linrandir]

Aww, a public ragequit.

Buh-bye.

[fitterpete]

Wow there are other trade sites where people have morals? Which ones?

[Shirokuma]

To the OP:
I can't see the logic in blaming a trading SITE for the actions of people with whom you enter trading negotiations.
Personally, I'd like to see the communications involved with these so-called back-outs, and I'd like to see them in the DEADBEATS AND BACKOUTS thread. That's why it's there -- so you can post the communications of a trade-gone-sour if you feel you've been treated unfairly.

Lin:
L-O-V-E the pic!

[PierceC]

As the question been asked, I will give some answers: warseer.com & druchii.net.

At both I have found have users who when they enter a negotiation, they don't undercut the negotiation just because they get a better offer. First come first serve, is first come first serve, not First come, I serve you until I get a better offer.

And to Shirokuma, a website is like any other community. The prevading rules, cultures, standards etc. attract certain people to that community, in general. If a site is attract a certain element of trader, then it is because of the "culture" of that community.

[reegsk]

I dunno, I think I'm with Lin on this one. I've had over fifty great trades, and I would say I entered negotiations on at least a few dozen more that, for whatever reason, didn't come to fruition. In my year on Btown, I would say I've had one, maybe two negotiations I'd consider a waste of time or actual backout. Maybe I'm just lucky and you're unlucky when it comes to finding trading partners, but I thoroughly enjoy the trading community here, and that I can feel safe in the knowledge that if someone does screw me, I have people I can turn to and rely upon to give me good advice and help me seek some sort of restitution. Seriously, check some of the Bad Trader threads. Some of the mods and watchers are friggin' bloodhounds when it comes to tracking down dirtbags.

And you didn't really reply to Shirokuma's main point. If people are backing out of trades so often, then post them on the deadbeats and backouts board so we can all shake our heads together. If you can't post them on there because they don't belong, well, you may have reached some frustrating negotiations, but it's true -- until you come to a solid agreement of "I give you x, you give me y" and the other person says "Ok/sounds good/let's do it/here's my address," well, that's just a negotiation gone south. It happens. But it's certainly no reason to write off an entire online community of people.

[govannon]

As the question been asked, I will give some answers: warseer.com & druchii.net.

At both I have found have users who when they enter a negotiation, they don't undercut the negotiation just because they get a better offer. First come first serve, is first come first serve, not First come, I serve you until I get a better offer.

And to Shirokuma, a website is like any other community. The prevading rules, cultures, standards etc. attract certain people to that community, in general. If a site is attract a certain element of trader, then it is because of the "culture" of that community.

BOO!






http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=akYmK0g16a8&feature=fvsr
How to Stop a Baby from Crying

[s_o_r_r_o_w]

At both I have found have users who when they enter a negotiation, they don't undercut the negotiation just because they get a better offer. First come first serve, is first come first serve, not First come, I serve you until I get a better offer.

And to Shirokuma, a website is like any other community. The prevading rules, cultures, standards etc. attract certain people to that community, in general. If a site is attract a certain element of trader, then it is because of the "culture" of that community.

Put your money where your mouth is and post the Back Out threads. Your refs indicate 10 trades in 2 years--how many bad ones have you had? Who have you left Neg Refs for?

It's hard for the police to do their job when the citizens don't report the crime.

[fitterpete]

I think his point is the "magical address exchange barrier" or something.He doesn't like it.So he's having trades called off BEFORE they are reportable as a Back Out.
Out of curiosity I would like to know when the OP considers a trade worthy of a backout.When the first PM is sent? When I read the trade add? When I wake up that morning and go to Btown?
And another thing how long are theses negotiations taking that your getting "under cut".Most of my deals take about 3.25 seconds and 1 and a half PMs.For that matter if it's all by PMs how are you getting "undercut"?
I think someone just wants to be a female dog here.

[s_o_r_r_o_w]

I think his point is the "magical address exchange barrier" or something.He doesn't like it.So he's having trades called off BEFORE they are reportable as a Back Out.

Ah. He doesn't like the deal making process.

@ PierceC:

Try these guys, they might be more your speed:

http://www.ebay.com/

[Shirokuma]

As the question been asked, I will give some answers: warseer.com & druchii.net.

At both I have found have users who when they enter a negotiation, they don't undercut the negotiation just because they get a better offer. First come first serve, is first come first serve, not First come, I serve you until I get a better offer.

And to Shirokuma, a website is like any other community. The prevading rules, cultures, standards etc. attract certain people to that community, in general. If a site is attract a certain element of trader, then it is because of the "culture" of that community.

All I have to say to your reply is this is BARTERtown.
If you go to an actual, real-live barter session, it isn't first-come, first-served. The trades are barter; dicker; haggle; Oh, you want some too? Ok!; You'll give me X+1, rather than just X? Ok! Sorry, trader A, but I have a better offer.

First-come, first served really only works in the world of {Price + Supply vs. Demand}. Prices are set for a limited quantity, and once demand has depleted said quantity, everyone else is out of luck.

Things like price gouging are against the rules, and if that was your experience, then - again - you should post the trade communications in the Deadbeats or Bad Trader forum.

I've had plenty of times where there is something I want, and I've had to suck it up and say, "Rats!" because someone either beat me to the punch, or another trader had something better to offer the posting trader.

[Dakkar98]

I trade on a first come first serve basis. I will entertain multiple offers, but I give priority to whoever contacted me first. If I get a better offer, I will give the original interested party a chance to meet of beat a late comers offer. But, if someone is low balling me or offering things I have no interest in from the start, I'll just say no thanks and move on.

I recently had a trader that I was negotiating with sell something out from under me because I was trying to make a trade with him and he got an offer to buy it. I suddenly went from negotiating for 5 items to negotiating for 2. I was pissed. I don't begrudge him taking a better offer necessarily. But, how hard would it have been for him to say: "I've got an offer for $X.XX for these things, and I'd rather sell them than trade. I started negotiating with you first so I'd like to give you a chance to meet or beat his offer." If I am not willing to pay that much, at least I was given a chance.

If he had done so, he probably could have sold all 5 to me for more, instead of selling 3 to the other guy for less and getting stuck with the other 2 because he pissed me off.

I really wouldn't care if someone took a better deal as long as I got a chance to counter offer if I started negotiating with him first. By the same token If I started negotiating second It would be nice for the heads up of "I am in negotiations for those items already, but if they fall through you are next in line for them."

If I am asking $2.50 OBO each for my old metal scouts. It doesn't matter if you contact me first if you are only offering $1.00 apiece, the guy right after you that offers me $2.00 each is going to get them.

If someone says in their ad "I put a prefer to trade rather than sell." then if you are offering to buy them at 30% off and someone else is offering trade at retail expect to lose out.
If someone says "Need cash, but will consider trades." then if you are offering to trade at retail and someone else is offering paypal at 40% off expect to lose out.

My $.02 for the OP and anyone else who wants it.

[Imaginos]

Things like price gouging are against the rules, and if that was your experience, then - again - you should post the trade communications in the Deadbeats or Bad Trader forum.

Would a mod or admin or watch member step in and point this part out to me in the rules? I just looked and I realize I might have missed it. But I don't recall ever seeing anything about price gouging being against the rules. As subjective as it is, I find it hard to believe a bad trader report or deadbeat could be filled out for a price gouger. When Space Hulk was released, there was some discussion about price gouging - and I thought the general sentiment was if you have it you can ask whatever you want for it. If someone is willing to pay your asking price, then they are.

Just looking for some clarification here.

[porkuslime]

Not sure what is being described as Price Gouging..

As far as the rules state, you are correct, people can charge whatever they can get. They might get flack for it, but they can put their own price on their items.

Maybe Shirokuma meant something like this..

Jim - "I have 10 orks for sale, $5"
Eric - "Hey, I will take them! Got paypal ready now!"
Jim - "Oh, someone else wanted them already... can you do $7 for them?" (when in fact that is not true)
Eric - "oh heck no"

That is price shenanigans and not nice. It is not in the rules either, but, still aggravatin'!

[Imaginos]

Yeah, that certainly would be a problem. I think, when you are already negotiating, it stretches credulity to come back and say "someone offered this much", because if that person counteroffers, the other person might want to counteroffer, and eventually you don't know if a guy is being honest or trying to pull your leg.

I just sold a couple of books on an RPG site. Had one guy come up and say "I'll give you $10 each for books A, B, and $20 for C." Another guy came up and said "I'll give you $18 each for books A and D." So I went back to the first guy and told him about the offer - he was fine to pass up on it. But it could just as easily been me trying to jack up the price of the item in a dishonest means of bartering rather than honest disclosure.