BTR - magnuslion - RESOLVED (PayPal)

[skarsol]

So PayPal ruled in my favor but after discussion with him, I'm faced with a dilemma as to how to proceed. Conversation thus far:

Re: 40k Lot of Bikes

Sent: Tue Jun 14, 2011 8:37 pm
by magnuslion
I take it you have not found a buyer yet? I just received the determination from paypal. I have ordered my bank not to allow any paypal transactions without my express consent. when are you planning on sending the figurines back? I wil not have the money until the 1st.

thank you

Re: 40k Lot of Bikes

Sent: Tue Jun 14, 2011 10:31 pm
by skarsol
No inquiries on the bikes yet on here. I responded to the Paypal thing on the last day possible. I have 10 days to provide a tracking number for sending it back to you, so can wait till 23rd and then with travel time should get close to the 1st.

Re: 40k Lot of Bikes

Sent: Tue Jun 14, 2011 10:40 pm
by magnuslion
ok I appreciate that. I am not sure what the hell I am going to do with them. could we maybe work out a deal? If I give you 150.00 on the first, and you just do not ship them back to me? I am worried about my account getting overdrawn. I dont really have any use for them anymore anyways. all of my friends that played 40k are gone thats why I was selling them.

I have no desire to mess the guy over, but I'm also loathe to relinquish the PayPal protection. If I wait the maximum time possible and send next Thursday, it's still going to be way before the first. I don't know enough about how PayPal does refunds. Will they try to direct draft his bank? The $150 offer worries me as it sounds too good to be true, plus, I don't want to take advantage of him. I would prefer to just be done with the whole thing. Suggestions?

[kturock]

Paypal can not draw from his bank account. PERIOD.

They can withdraw any money he has in his Paypal account.

They will attach his account and if money ever arrives in his account, and they notice it, they will withdraw it and send it to you.

So, if he has $37 in his account, you get $37. The rest? Your SOL. If he gets another $22 in his account, they will send that to you.

If he never gets any more money into his account....well, he owes you.

Paypal protection is only lipservice.

MM had a post explaining that Paypal isn't a bank, and the rules that regulate it. What it can & can't do.

[The Grey Knight]

What could have happened in this case, he did not empty his paypal account before you filed on him and is locked out until this is resolved. If you cancel the complaint he can get his cash out of paypal and you can not refile with paypal.

His claims about offers from e bay don't make scense as either your selling something there or your not, and he had all ready sold them to you.

[s_o_r_r_o_w]

It might be worth getting a PayPal rep on the phone to discuss your concerns about receiving payment. If the money is frozen in the account, then you're probably safe. If it's not, then you could be screwed.

The whole delay of payment issue does make this complicated. Maybe PayPal can give you an extension on sending them back?

[MagickalMemories]

@kt

That's not entirely correct.
PayPal *can* withdraw from his attached account. They just *won't.* They don't want to deal with it. They got their money, so your problem is really only a secondary (at best) concern to them.

Example:
There have been cases of people who paid via PayPal with a Credit Card. When something bad happened, they went to their Credit Card company to dispute it. The CC Co took the money back from PayPal who then went after the guy's checking account. At that point, it was THEIR wallet getting hit, and they suddenly cared.

That's why their terms say (or USED to say, at least) that they want you to contact them for ALL disputes, and not your bank or CC Co. It's because they know what'll happen.

Similar circumstance... the person filed with PayPal first. Wasn't happy with the result. Called CC Co... CC Co refused, since they'd already went through PayPal.



I don't want to sound callous, because I do feel for magnuslion, but you've got to watch out for yourself.

Eric

[kturock]

@MM ahh ok. I thoguht you said because they weren't a 'real bank' they couldn't.
My mistake.

[skarsol]

Okay, I called PayPal and spoke to them and they said that I should ship it now and they would refund my money and that if his held balance went negative as a result of that, then that was something that he could resolve once he had money, so it shouldn't put him at any hardship by me shipping within the 10 day window. They were unwilling to extend the window. So based on that, I feel comfortable just shipping it back to him and that it wont result in any additional financial harm to him, so I'm gonna go ahead and do that, likely tomorrow.

[s_o_r_r_o_w]

so I'm gonna go ahead and do that, likely tomorrow.

Word of advice: photo documentation.

[MagickalMemories]

so I'm gonna go ahead and do that, likely tomorrow.

Word of advice: photo documentation.

Yes.

...and don't forget the required D.C. #. Insurance might not be a bad idea, either.


Eric

[Forsaken Poptart]

It might also be a bit late, but I would take down the name and number/email address of the person at Paypal who told you this- I've been burned a couple of times by companies suddenly reversing their stories when it was convenient for them.

[skarsol]

Re: 40k Lot of Bikes

Sent: Tue Jun 21, 2011 3:32 pm
From: skarsol
To: magnuslion
Sent USPS: 03100480000317407499
Insured it for $180. I reused your materials/box and also wrapped the arms and such that fell off in the first shipping in brown paper and added some more brown paper between layers to hopefully avoid any more of the same.

[skarsol]

The drama continues.

Detailed Results:

Bullet Delivered, June 28, 2011, 4:13 pm, LA PINE, OR 97739
Bullet Sorting Complete, June 24, 2011, 8:23 am, LA PINE, OR 97739
Bullet Notice Left, June 24, 2011, 7:09 am, LA PINE, OR 97739
Bullet Arrival at Unit, June 24, 2011, 5:55 am, LA PINE, OR 97739
Bullet Processed through Sort Facility, June 21, 2011, 6:27 pm, HOUSTON, TX 77201
Bullet Acceptance, June 21, 2011, 3:24 pm, HOUSTON, TX 77046

Yesterday PayPal reset the claim to Awaiting other party's response and so I PM'd him on here asking about the status. PMs follow:

Re: 40k Lot of Bikes

Sent: Tue Jun 28, 2011 8:52 am
by skarsol
Looks like Paypal sent you an email about this this morning. Checking the tracking, it looks like the box is sitting at the post office? Did you get the notice they say they left?

Re: 40k Lot of Bikes

Sent: Tue Jun 28, 2011 5:20 pm
by magnuslion
I was not here today, but I do not have a notice slip from them. I will check at the P.O. tommorow and see if they have it.

Re: 40k Lot of Bikes

Sent: Tue Jun 28, 2011 9:52 pm
by magnuslion
so, you sent it to the wrong address. I will not be able to recover it, ever. so now I will lose at on the money, and my army.

Re: 40k Lot of Bikes

Sent: Tue Jun 28, 2011 10:04 pm
by skarsol
I sent it to the address Paypal told me to send it to. What was at that address? The tracking info says it was delivered at 4:48 today, I assumed that meant you picked it from the postal office. I just checked the PayPal dispute and it does not list the address anymore. I wrote it down on the tracking receipt but that's at work. I will get it for you in the morning, but it's whatever you have as your address on Paypal I assume.

Re: 40k Lot of Bikes

Sent: Tue Jun 28, 2011 10:07 pm
From: magnuslion
To: skarsol
my address is 20833 penny lane, bend or. The Lapine address you sent it to has not been my home for almost three years. Paypal is <not smart>. I will not be able to recover the army, the person that lives in that house is psychotic and would not even forward bills and such to me. angry because I chose to leave. I have changed the adress on paypal three times to no apparent avail.

Re: 40k Lot of Bikes

Sent: Tue Jun 28, 2011 10:12 pm
From: skarsol
To: magnuslion
I don't think they're allowed to keep mail that's not addressed to them? I wouldn't think it would be difficult to get the police involved if they won't return it. I'm sorry I sent it to the wrong place. If you knew the Paypal address was wrong, why didn't you say something earlier?

So there's that. No clue where to go from there.

[kturock]

contact the post office of the address it was delivered to.

was it insured? if so, and the name on the package isn't the same the house/apt; THEY made a mistake.
you might be able to get teh $ from the insurance. The letter carrier is SUPPOSED to check the name on the package vs the name on the house.

If this is a domestic problem, sounds like you left a spouse or GF, BY LAW, she's not allowed to touch your mail, let allon accept it or not forward or return it to you.

"the person that lives in that house is psychotic and would not even forward bills and such to me. angry because I chose to leave."

That's theft of mail.. 5 years & $5000 fine PER ITEM.

contact the supervisor of the delivery address. tell them the entire situtaion. the package and other mail not forwarded or held/kept.
depending on what they say, you'll probably have to contact the postal inspectors & possibly the local police.

[Forsaken Poptart]

That this only jumps out now, after the box has been shipped and delivered, is highly suspicious to me.

It is not up to anyone but you to keep your addresses up to date- it takes no more than 5 minutes online (or a phone call) to Paypal to verify a change of address.

While I sympathize with magnuslion if what he says is true (I have no reason not to believe it, btw), quite literally everything that has happened here could have been avoided with a few minutes of due diligence.

[MagickalMemories]

As you sent to the address Paypal told you to, I think you're fine. had you shipped to the WRONG address (the one not on file) and he claimed not to have received it, you'd be SOL.


Eric