Sun Tzu26 - [Admin edit] or cant follow rules

They're not Bad Traders per se but they are REALLY annoying. Tell us about them here. READ THE RULES.

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Ironhide ( 92 )
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Re: Sun Tzu26 - possible scam attempt or cant follow rules

Post by Ironhide » Fri Oct 30, 2009 3:02 pm

That is a story for another day. If you want to know why Creeper, contact Sun Tzu via PM and ask him. There are several ways to receive a good ref and not leave one in return.
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Repeter ( 200 )
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Re: Sun Tzu26 - possible scam attempt or cant follow rules

Post by Repeter » Fri Oct 30, 2009 9:50 pm

Whether or not a negative sticks to SunTzu for this fiasco, I wouldn't trade with anyone that wasn't willing to follow the very wise and fair rules of Bartertown.

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Re: Sun Tzu26 - possible scam attempt or cant follow rules

Post by MagickalMemories » Fri Oct 30, 2009 10:05 pm

Repeter wrote:Whether or not a negative sticks to SunTzu for this fiasco, I wouldn't trade with anyone that wasn't willing to follow the very wise and fair rules of Bartertown.
Lowest rating ships first is not now and has NO plans to be a Bartertown rule.
It is, simply, a guideline that is supported by the vast majority of traders here on the site. Especially the more experienced ones who have seen the numerous repercussions for NOT following that guideline.


Eric
Lower rating? You ship first.

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I think what this situation needs is some imagination.

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Repeter ( 200 )
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Re: Sun Tzu26 - possible scam attempt or cant follow rules

Post by Repeter » Sat Oct 31, 2009 2:16 pm

MagickalMemories wrote:
Repeter wrote:Whether or not a negative sticks to SunTzu for this fiasco, I wouldn't trade with anyone that wasn't willing to follow the very wise and fair rules of Bartertown.
Lowest rating ships first is not now and has NO plans to be a Bartertown rule.
It is, simply, a guideline that is supported by the vast majority of traders here on the site. Especially the more experienced ones who have seen the numerous repercussions for NOT following that guideline.


Eric
Replace 'rules' with 'customs' or 'traditions' then, if it makes you feel better. Although from my standpoint, Btown has its rules and the traders have theirs. If you are a smart trader, you will make it a personal rule that 'lower rating ships first', even if Btown wants to call it a 'guideline'.

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starslayer ( 558 )
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Re: Sun Tzu26 - possible scam attempt or cant follow rules

Post by starslayer » Sat Oct 31, 2009 2:27 pm

Repeter wrote:
MagickalMemories wrote:
Repeter wrote:Whether or not a negative sticks to SunTzu for this fiasco, I wouldn't trade with anyone that wasn't willing to follow the very wise and fair rules of Bartertown.
Lowest rating ships first is not now and has NO plans to be a Bartertown rule.
It is, simply, a guideline that is supported by the vast majority of traders here on the site. Especially the more experienced ones who have seen the numerous repercussions for NOT following that guideline.


Eric
Replace 'rules' with 'customs' or 'traditions' then, if it makes you feel better. Although from my standpoint, Btown has its rules and the traders have theirs. If you are a smart trader, you will make it a personal rule that 'lower rating ships first', even if Btown wants to call it a 'guideline'.
You are correct that it is a general guideline or custom here. But the point was it is not an enforceable rule. You cannot leave a negative reference because someone wont send first to someone with a higher reference total. It is not mandatory.

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Repeter ( 200 )
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Re: Sun Tzu26 - possible scam attempt or cant follow rules

Post by Repeter » Sat Oct 31, 2009 2:55 pm

@ Starslayer: I understand the connotation quite well, but thank you for the further explanation.

While this situation probably doesn't warrant a bad trade, or even a backout, it is nice to have read about this scenario. As such, I know I won't trade with SunTzu26, whether he violated an actual rule or not. Now, how would I know this if I hadn't read this thread, which technically has no place on Btown, but remains vital info, imo? Simply, I would have to go through my own dealings with the dude, which would most likely just end badly and take up alot of time. This may be the fairest thing to do, and the method that Btown supports, but I am glad to have read about SunTzu26 here, so I don't ever have to waste my time with him.

My point boiled down: SunTzu26 violated no official rules, but I am happy he has been called out for his methods. If the OP deals with any flak for it, something seems wrong.

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starslayer ( 558 )
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Re: Sun Tzu26 - possible scam attempt or cant follow rules

Post by starslayer » Sat Oct 31, 2009 3:12 pm

You are going to find traders like that regardless of what you do. I have over a 300+ here & i still get traders with a score under 10 demanding I pay them first. "Buying is different then trading" is a favorite line. Just dont do it. :-D

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Re: Sun Tzu26 - possible scam attempt or cant follow rules

Post by HarlequinZero » Sun Nov 01, 2009 4:23 am

@Repeter & Starslayer: If you wish to have a discussion about rules vs. guidelines go to the Misc. area and start a topic. Do NOT highjack a backout thread.
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Re: Sun Tzu26 - possible scam attempt or cant follow rules

Post by starslayer » Sun Nov 01, 2009 2:59 pm

Sir! Yes Sir! My apologies.

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Re: Sun Tzu26 - possible scam attempt or cant follow rules

Post by kelanen » Mon Nov 09, 2009 2:25 pm

If this is not relevant then Mods please delete - but I believe it is actually contectual, and not threadjacking

[Admin Edit]
While you had good intent, your post was really just opinion and facts about the trade YOU had with him. It really wasn't relevant to the issues at hand.
As such, I've edited your post. NO warnings were/will be issued.
Eric
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Re: Sun Tzu26 - possible scam attempt or cant follow rules

Post by JohnHwangBT » Mon Nov 09, 2009 9:31 pm

MagickalMemories wrote:Well, you make a valid point.
My opinion on it is that ST26 agreed to the shipping order, then tried to "sneak one in" on the OP and succeeded.

Eric
NO, you are 100% absolutely wrong here!

Once Ast asked, he reopened negotiations, and all previous offers were rendered NULL AND VOID.

SunTzu should hit Asty with a Neg for Backout, and it is defensible by this thread.
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Re: Sun Tzu26 - possible scam attempt or cant follow rules

Post by JohnHwangBT » Mon Nov 09, 2009 9:44 pm

Here is the basis for a fully-justified Neg by Sun Tsu 26...
SunTzu26 wrote:Oct 25, 2009 10:33 pm
by Sun Tzu26

Hey Jeff

Deal is 6 CSM Terms, 6 plauge Marines and the Lord for 5 Warp Spiders and a Heavy Weapon with 2 crew. I will send a "Shadow Weaver" and a 'Virbo Cannon". I'm good with it. I need your info agian. I was clearing PM's and deleted it. Once I receive the tracking number then within 24hrs I will send it off and PM you the tracking number.

Thanks,

Paul
Sun Tzu26 clearly lays out what is to be traded, along with shipping protocol.
Astynax wrote: Re: H: CSM, VC W: Eldar, SM
Sent: Mon Oct 26, 2009 12:00 am
by Astynax

Hey Paul,

Yep that sounds good.
At this point, all conditions are agreed, and it is up to both parties to fulfill.

Afterwards, Asty attempts to change the terms of the deal by reversing the shipping.

At this point, Sun Tzu26 is completely within his rights to demand that Asty follow through with shipping first. That is what was mutually agreed.

Asty changing his mind after the fact in no way invalidates the contract that was agreed above.

As far as I'm concerned, Sun Tzu26 is 100% right, and Asty is 100% wrong. Asty doesn't understand contract law and would get hammered by any judge in any court of law.

Personally, if I were Sun Tzu, I'd Neg immediately. The facts clearly support such an action.
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Re: Sun Tzu26 - possible scam attempt or cant follow rules

Post by MagickalMemories » Mon Nov 09, 2009 10:26 pm

JohnHwangBT wrote:
MagickalMemories wrote:Well, you make a valid point.
My opinion on it is that ST26 agreed to the shipping order, then tried to "sneak one in" on the OP and succeeded.

Eric
NO, you are 100% absolutely wrong here!

Once Ast asked, he reopened negotiations, and all previous offers were rendered NULL AND VOID.

SunTzu should hit Asty with a Neg for Backout, and it is defensible by this thread.
John... you of all people should know that an opinion, by definition, can never be wrong.

You might feel that I came to the wrong conclusion, or that my opinion is faulty, but it cannot be wrong.

Eric
Lower rating? You ship first.

Give me a sense of humor Lord. Give me the grace to see a joke.
To get some humor out of life and pass it on to other folk.


I think what this situation needs is some imagination.

"...I'm a nerd, and I'm here tonight to stand up for the rights of other nerds.” – Gilbert Lowell

Want my help with a BTR or backout? All messages sent/posted should be in CHRONOLOGICAL order. Otherwise, I just won't read it.

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JohnHwangBT ( 180 )
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Re: Sun Tzu26 - possible scam attempt or cant follow rules

Post by JohnHwangBT » Tue Nov 10, 2009 1:31 am

Point noted.
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