Deadbet / Backout: the_trader

They're not Bad Traders per se but they are REALLY annoying. Tell us about them here. READ THE RULES.

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govannon ( 116 )
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Re: Deadbet / Backout: the_trader

Post by govannon » Fri Dec 05, 2008 4:28 am

kelanen wrote:
redstarone wrote: The fact you mention his last name and such, he will now know I gave that out... which will now lose me all cred I have with him.
It's public knowledge - if you click on his number of refs beside his name (currently -14 and dropping...) then it shows his name as Joseph Bartle.

...and with all due respect, it's more about getting justice for all, than just saving your bacon...
I don't think he was doing it to save his bacon.
I think he was trying to work to get some kind of resolution for everybody affected.

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kelanen ( 148 )
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Re: Deadbet / Backout: the_trader

Post by kelanen » Fri Dec 05, 2008 4:39 am

Okay, I can see I misread that, so apologies RedStarOne...

I stand by the fact the name was accessible to anyone looking however.
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Re: Deadbet / Backout: the_trader

Post by redstarone » Fri Dec 05, 2008 4:44 am

govannon wrote:
kelanen wrote:
redstarone wrote: The fact you mention his last name and such, he will now know I gave that out... which will now lose me all cred I have with him.
It's public knowledge - if you click on his number of refs beside his name (currently -14 and dropping...) then it shows his name as Joseph Bartle.

...and with all due respect, it's more about getting justice for all, than just saving your bacon...
I don't think he was doing it to save his bacon.
I think he was trying to work to get some kind of resolution for everybody affected.

Govannon
EXACTLY.

The guy ripped me off to.

The differnce between me and all the others that got ripped is he talks to me. Im explaing to him the best bet it to resolve this, not vanish.

And BTW I take serious offence to "me trying to save my own bacon".

And because of that, im no no longer providing any help to ANYONE besides those that were affected by the_trader. Everyone else that seems to poke thier nose into it, fine, go ahead. I can bet money you wont get anywhere while at the same time ive gotten extremly close to getting at least some of the models..


That said im willing to guess ive done MORE to resolve this then all of the others combined... ask MM or LIn, or even Porkuslime, not to mention 3 of the people he ripped off... So please done make accusations you know nothing about.

PS I just woke up from a nap so yes im cranky and took major offence to me "saving my own bacon" as extactly what bacon am i saving? I did NOTHING wrong except try and be a good guy to help resolve this.

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Re: Deadbet / Backout: the_trader

Post by redstarone » Fri Dec 05, 2008 4:51 am

In my half asleepness I didnt see the apology.

My bad completly.

MM had mentioned to me in a PM earlier that even thought im helping others, some people my thingk badly of it for whatever reason and it could ruin my rep here.

My entire buisness relies on my rep here so in a way im simply helping to show im not a dick. (im sometimes word things badly and seem like a complete ass)

Im also doing this to hopfully get the money owed to me as well.

All that said, joseph for sure made some serious mistakes. But he really is scared and trying to resolve this all with my help. Ive talked with him over the last 3 days on MSN chat. Long chats too.

Im close to startong to resolve this for some of you. Others its going to be a bit tougher.

Now if he will still talk with me, I can still suceed. But if he keeps thinking there is no choice except to vanish... he will.

So please, let me work with MM, LIn and Pork as well as the people ripped off to solve this. ANyone else that has nothing to do with it PLEASE stay out of it. All it does is confuse me and how all he got money from.

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Re: Deadbet / Backout: the_trader

Post by TrooperPX » Fri Dec 05, 2008 10:24 am

I'll say this publicly, thank you for what you've done in your efforts with the_trader. If Joseph can resolve this and make amends, it will prevent this from going down a bad, bad road. I'm willing to back the preassure off if it will yield results... but if it dosen't pan out, it'll make Brick Top look like Santa. :-|
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starslayer ( 558 )
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Re: Deadbet / Backout: the_trader

Post by starslayer » Fri Dec 05, 2008 8:41 pm

Redstarone- DUDE. Look on his refs. His name is there. No one opened their mouth, but you.

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Re: Deadbet / Backout: the_trader

Post by uscmbuzz » Sat Dec 06, 2008 4:22 pm

Gentlemen I have to ask.. Whats the problem with recieving your funds back from paypal..Unless I am mistaken.. and you did it as a "goods" transation you have 45 days to open a dispute for a refund and they give you all your funds back..

For example.. I paid $1200 for a Armorcast Ork Great Gargant.. the guy said he was shipping it .. I contacted him a few times and he said he shipped it..After waiting 35 days opened a dispute. And emailed him through paypal the people must answer your questions or the disupute gets closed automatically by paypal and you get your money back. At 40 days of the guy giving me excuses, and saying my item accidentally went to australia .

I called paypal by phone and talked with a rep.. He reviewed the responses.. cuz he can read them.And just couldnt believe the guys excuses were true... And informed me I had every right to my funds back as the item was never delievered and the sender couldnt prove shipment.. If the guy refunds the money the dispute is closed automatically.. The guy asked me to close the dispute so he could help me.. this worried the pp rep and he informed me to tell the guy the dipute could be closed if he just refunded me my money.. so I told the guy.. and even though upset I was doing everything through paypal he did gimme back the money.. no choice.. paypal will give it back to you if your the buyer...
Anyway I got my $1200 back..

I dont know if this will help yall.. but really if you do a paypal deal and open a dispute then post a question in the dispute it goes directly to the seller and he has like 3 days to answer your question.. otherwise he faults the funds and they go back to you..if he does continue to respond.. you can escalate the dispute to a claim.. but that gets reviewed.. if he cant provide a tracking # and show delivery.. then you get your money back.. any questions paypal reps can answer the phone # is on the site.. the rep I spoke with was very helpfull.. hey but be aware whatever you write in questions to the guy.. paypal will see when they review it so dont be a jerk..

hope this helps guys..

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Re: Deadbet / Backout: the_trader

Post by porkuslime » Sat Dec 06, 2008 4:49 pm

That ONLY works if there is the money in the bad guys account. If he has drained it and there is a zero balance.. you are outta luck!

Seriously, this is a facet of PayPal that is taken advantage of by scammers ... open a new paypal account.. get folks to deposit money there... close it or take all money out.. and that is that.

I am thrilled, usmcbuzz, that you got a refund.. but your story is a lot less seen than the other way.

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Folks I am awaiting a ref from.. Zack

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Re: Deadbet / Backout: the_trader

Post by uscmbuzz » Sun Dec 07, 2008 4:48 am

Ok I see how that now works.. I barely do bussiness with overseas guys anymore due to the exact problem yall speak of.. especially if they are buying something from me.. cuz I get worried they are gonna say it didnt arrive and get the money from my acct... which works apparently cuz I have my bank acct joined to my paypal acct.. so if my acct is empty paypal pulls it from my bank acct...wow I may have to change that as I am tired of stuff I send getting lost and going to the island of lost toys..

thanks alot for explaining this .. it is one of the reasons I asked in the 1st place.. haha. as I just didnt undestand.. but now I get it..

I wonder if I can limit access from paypal to my bank acct to avoid future problems..

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Bookwrack ( 44 )
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Re: Deadbet / Backout: the_trader

Post by Bookwrack » Tue Dec 09, 2008 12:09 am

porkuslime wrote:That ONLY works if there is the money in the bad guys account. If he has drained it and there is a zero balance.. you are outta luck!
Actually, no, that's not how it works at all. If you drain your account and then get a chargeback, your account goes into the negative, and you start getting calls from Paypal's accounting department about the money you owe them. I don't know how it works in the UK, but if you don't pay off your balance the total then gets forwarded to a collections agency, which has all sorts of unpleasant consequences.
These things happen.

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Bookwrack ( 44 )
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Re: Deadbet / Backout: the_trader

Post by Bookwrack » Tue Dec 09, 2008 12:11 am

The hypothetical guy can't even hide if he drains, and then cancels his paypal account. That doesn't erase it from their files, so if you scam people, drain it, cancel, and figure you're good to go, you've got another thing coming once Paypal starts processing the disputes against you.
These things happen.

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Re: Deadbet / Backout: the_trader

Post by MagickalMemories » Tue Dec 09, 2008 7:00 am

I'd like to know where you're getting this information. Preferably, with links to the PayPal site, where it supports your claims.

Why do I ask?

Well, I've been doing this a while... as have numerous others... and we've seen our share of scammers come and go.

Not once have we seen it work as you describe... and we've seen a bunch.

Typically, the complaintant gets his $$ back IF the dumbass scammer hasn't emptied the account yet, or he gets a nice little email from PayPal, informing him that, "Congtarulations!" they have ruled in his favor... Which is followed by a sort of apology for the fact that they can't do anything, as there are no funds in his account.
... "But, if any funds DO become available in his account, [they'll] be CERTAIN to put a hold on them and send 'em off to you."

Additionally, complaints to CC companies (and I've experienced this one personally, too) get the "Sorry, Charlie" routine, as the transaction WE authorized (a payment to PayPal so that they would send the money to someone else) was performed as required.

I'd love to see something positive in regards to this, however.
Please, show me (Note: NO sarcasm. I'm being genuine).

Eric
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I think what this situation needs is some imagination.

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Re: Deadbet / Backout: the_trader

Post by Phaze24 » Wed Dec 10, 2008 6:24 am

well you can add me to the list that the_trader has burned, i just put my dispute in on paypal, and we'll see if he replies...
If you have 90 or less refs, you ship first and pay first, no exceptions

it takes 30 secs so answer a message plz do so, in a timely manner it makes much easier

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Re: Deadbet / Backout: the_trader

Post by porkuslime » Wed Dec 10, 2008 1:22 pm

Phaze24 wrote:well you can add me to the list that the_trader has burned, i just put my dispute in on paypal, and we'll see if he replies...
And now YOU need to open a BTR on him. Follow the rules, post all communications, etc..

Also, Norseman is running a thread in the Have Questions forum for tracking all the_trader's victims.. send him a PM or post in that thread .. AFTER you get the BTR up..

-Porkuslime
2+2=5 for sufficiently large values of 2.

If you don't have your Location listed in your User Control Panel, why not take a second and update it? It will let your trading partners know where you are from the beginning.

I use the Unofficial Porkuslime Trading Guidelines - if you have way less refs.. you ship first.

Folks I am awaiting a ref from.. Zack

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Re: Deadbet / Backout: the_trader

Post by Bookwrack » Thu Dec 11, 2008 6:05 am

MagickalMemories wrote:I'd like to know where you're getting this information. Preferably, with links to the PayPal site, where it supports your claims.
It came my way secondhand, but I secondhand knew a guy who'd sold a bike frame over ebay for about $1k. The buyer turned out to be a real psycho, there was a whole bunch of weirdness as they buyer tried to get a refund from the seller, the USPS, the bike shop he took the frame too to get it looked at, and after the buyer tracked down a number for him, called and shouted at him, the seller closed his paypal account before the buyer figured out transaction disputes. About a month later he got a call from Paypal, telling him he owed them the amount of the transaction.

That's the abbreviated version of it, but I heard it through a direct acquaintance of the guy, so the veracity did not seem suspect. It'd been a developing situation over the course of a couple weeks.
These things happen.

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