HELP! Half my trade is being ransomed!

ancientsociety · Post by **ancientsociety** » Wed Aug 23, 2006 2:39 pm

Started a trade to get some Conf cards. The trader had no refs at the time of the deal and, when asked, agreed to send first and I agreed to payment upon receipt. However, he just wrote me and said that only half the cards were sent and he was "keeping" the others until he rec'd payment.

This is against BT rules yes (esp. after he agreed to the deal and agreed to shipment/payment terms)????

HELP!

From: ancientsociety ( 44 )
To:
Posted: Mon Aug 21, 2006 11:53 pm
Subject: cards
I'd be interested in:

Aberration (2 cards)
Hybrid (1 card)
Templar of Hod Seneschal (2 cards)
Temple Purifier (1 card)

These are the Confr. cards for the models from the Hybrid game right? How much do you want for them? LMK thanks

From:
To: ancientsociety
Posted: Tue Aug 22, 2006 12:11 am
Subject: Re: cards Quote message
ancientsociety wrote:
These are the Confr. cards for the models from the Hybrid game right?

that's correct.

do you have any spare promo/art cards?

... I also see you are looking for the Howling Clan box set. I have one to trade/sell, see down the board for details. It is under offer though but that shouldn't stop you making an offer.

From: ancientsociety ( 44 )
To:
Posted: Tue Aug 22, 2006 12:19 am
Subject: Re: cards
How about $45 (all I have right now in my PP acct) for the cards and the HP box (this is NIB right?)

From:
To: ancientsociety
Posted: Tue Aug 22, 2006 12:38 am
Subject: Re: cards Quote message
ancientsociety wrote:
How about $45 (all I have right now in my PP acct) for the cards and the HP box (this is NIB right?)

yes it's NIB but cards for the 3 original proxy profiles are not included. You can also choose between the Daikinee and a proxy Howling Predator hard boiled. check listing for details.

$45 would be OK but I fear postage to the US is going to shave too much of that. I will get a quote if you are interested but maybe you can send me the Skorize to cover that cost?

From: ancientsociety ( 44 )
To:
Posted: Tue Aug 22, 2006 12:44 am
Subject: Re: cards
Oh forget about the HP box then. I only trade for items with full card sets (part of the reason for the card buying now). How about $10 for the cards only?

From:
To: ancientsociety
Posted: Tue Aug 22, 2006 1:00 am
Subject: Re: cards Quote message
ancientsociety wrote:
How about $10 for the cards only?

that's more than enough. my paypal is (UK - Verified 46)

don't forget to include your address or send it separately by PM.

From: ancientsociety ( 44 )
To:
Posted: Tue Aug 22, 2006 1:07 am
Subject: Re: cards
Can you send first and I will pay upon receipt? Right now, you have 0 refs and I always ask that people with less refs send first. LMK thanks

From:
To: ancientsociety
Posted: Tue Aug 22, 2006 8:06 am
Subject: Re: cards Quote message
ancientsociety wrote:
Can you send first and I will pay upon receipt? Right now, you have 0 refs and I always ask that people with less refs send first. LMK thanks

My paypal profile has 46 accreditation, this should be a piece of mind.

Anyway that's not a problem (though I would definitely have refused for minis) but I still don't have your address...

From: ancientsociety ( 44 )
To:
Posted: Tue Aug 22, 2006 9:11 am
Subject: Re: cards
Jeremy Olsen
6161 N Winthrop 210
Chicago, IL 60660

I should point out since you're new here that refs on other sites aren't valid here on BT (esp. Paypal since having a verification number only means you've exchanged monies with other verified PP members, not pos or neg refs). Expect to do a lot of shipping first until you get your refs up. It's just a rule of thumb.

From:
To: ancientsociety
Posted: Tue Aug 22, 2006 10:10 am
Subject: Re: cards Quote message
ancientsociety wrote:
Expect to do a lot of shipping first until you get your refs up. It's just a rule of thumb.

actually I have traded CCGs for 10 years and never been asked... I guess there are people out there that will pull a fast one on a $10 deal but I'm 35 and earn good money. I got much more productive things to do.

Besides AFAIK you only get points in a Paypal account for receiving money. If not they've robbed me feedback for years. Last, Paypal covers you from fraudsters, doesn't it.

Anyway I'm not offended but just to say everyone needs to put water in their wine, sometimes. I'll send the cards first as agreed but don't be surprised if you find people like me who like to deal on a trust basis rather 'trade by numbers'.

Best Regards,

From:
To: ancientsociety
Posted: Wed Aug 23, 2006 1:57 pm
Subject: Re: cards Quote message
sorry, no one likes to be bullied. I just checked and my wine is not as sweet as I thought it was. It has aged beyond expectations!

so I have posted the Hybrid, Seneschal and Purifier cards today. If you want the rest you will have to pay upfront I'm afraid. So you owe me $5 on receipt of this lot, or $10 if you want me to follow through with the remainder.

Best Regards,

PS: you didn't say but your address is in the mighty USA, right? sorry I'm just an earth man in a corner of the globe.

From: ancientsociety ( 44 )
To:
Posted: Wed Aug 23, 2006 2:25 pm
Subject: Re: cards Edit message
wrote:
sorry, no one likes to be bullied. I just checked and my wine is not as sweet as I thought it was. It has aged beyond expectations!

so I have posted the Hybrid, Seneschal and Purifier cards today. If you want the rest you will have to pay upfront I'm afraid. So you owe me $5 on receipt of this lot, or $10 if you want me to follow through with the remainder.

Best Regards,

PS: you didn't say but your address is in the mighty USA, right? sorry I'm just an earth man in a corner of the globe.

Huh? You didn't include the Aberattion cards!? That's not what our deal was for! Our deal was for the

Aberration
Hybrid
Seneschal
Purifier

cards. You have not sent the full deal. How am I "bullying" you? I simply mentioned that its a general expectation (it's in the BT rules, BTW) that the person with lower feedback sends first which you agreed to. Also, I'm not the one who is withholding cards AFTER a deal has been made. I will not pay ANY money until I receive the full card amount.

viewtopic.php?t=69

You told me that some people "deal on a trust basis". Guess what? You just lost my trust. I'd recommend getting the Aberration cards in the mail today. If you refuse to send the cards as agreed, I will not pay for them.

titan136 · Post by **titan136** » Wed Aug 23, 2006 3:12 pm

Man thats pretty crappy...and doubles postage costs...not to mention trade time.

i used to do a lot of CCG trading on magictraders.com and other trading boards, I can vouch for the fact that refs determine sendin order for most of these trades and not "trust" =\

DarkSoul · Post by **DarkSoul** » Wed Aug 23, 2006 3:34 pm

if this was me... I would refuse to send the cash.. and offer to send him back the cards at his expense, or he can send the rest and they you pay for them all... make it his choice.

starslayer · Post by **starslayer** » Wed Aug 23, 2006 3:47 pm

Thats a deal-breaker. He changed the terms of the deal, half-waythrough. If anyone is being a "bully" its him. Its basically extortion.

I would:
1)Call off the deal.
2)Inform him to forward funds to pay the cost of shipping to return his items.
3)Leave a negative reference.

PS. That wasn't wine,it was my urine sample.

He has done nothing to earn trust, in fact, just the opposite.

Zaakath · Post by **Zaakath** » Wed Aug 23, 2006 4:03 pm

I have to agree with star.

Cancel all; wait until you receive money to pay for the return of his cards, no matter the expense (even if it's a single stamp), and leave a neg ref.

Jack

Alsiaie · Post by **Alsiaie** » Wed Aug 23, 2006 5:31 pm

I'm with star. I've delt with a few trades exactly like this personally and through my moderator experience. If you are really in desperate need of the items, do what darksoul suggests. Becareful with your feedback though. If the seller agrees to pay for shipping on the return package, you are technically at no loss. A no loss trade gone bad does not always justify a negative feedback. For all of you reading this, don't be afraid to ask a moderator about leaving bad feedback if you are unsure what to do. The group had an interesting case not too long ago that was borderline negative.

( 108 ) · Post by **Linrandir** » Wed Aug 23, 2006 7:24 pm

Wow...that's, uhm, special. Yeah, the idea is that once trade terms are set and agreed to by both parties the terms are adhered to until the deal is completed. They're not changed halfway through because someone gets a burr in their jammies.

While I don't think this warrants a Bad Trader Report, I would definitely follow Starslayer's advice. And not trade with him again.

Situations like this are tricky. The staff can offer our advice, but in the end the decision is yours.

ancientsociety · Post by **ancientsociety** » Wed Aug 23, 2006 7:46 pm

Thanks for the help all (this is why I love BT so much - you guys rock!). Check out his most current PM and my reply

From: Rogue ( 2 )
To: ancientsociety
Posted: Wed Aug 23, 2006 4:50 pm
Subject: Re: cards Quote message
ancientsociety wrote:
You told me that some people "deal on a trust basis". Guess what? You just lost my trust. I'd recommend getting the Aberration cards in the mail today. If you refuse to send the cards as agreed, I will not pay for them.

trust, which trust? the one you never had? come on. don't pay for the 6 cards I sent you - that's completely equal to me.

I don't expect anything from you, you are obviously a self centric individual and I'm waaaay too old to deal with this kind of crap! ... if you are in this business to feed your paranoia just watch the X files and everybody will be better off.

'respectfully'
RM

PS: I didn't kill JFK, I swear!

Check out my topic under the "Have Questions? Need Help?" section. The mods agree that you can't change the terms of the agreement halfway through. So you have 2 options:

1. Call off the trade and forward me the cash for return postage
2. Send the rest of the cards as per our original deal and I will pay upon receipt

Failure to do either means that you are open to neg refs. Like I said in my last PM, you NEED to sit down and READ the BT rules. You can't change the terms of a trade halfway through.

ancientsociety · Post by **ancientsociety** » Wed Aug 23, 2006 8:11 pm

The horror continues to unfold (personally I feel the following violates Rule #6 - audience???):

From: Rogue ( 2 )
To: ancientsociety
Posted: Wed Aug 23, 2006 8:02 pm
Subject: Re: cards Quote message
ancientsociety wrote:
You can't change the terms of a trade halfway through.

mate. don't waste your precious energy hypothesizing what evil plan there is behind an irrational and unpredictable dot gesticulating in one of your province. You won't get any feedback at all:

when a guy from old Europe encounters an obstacle we go around it and we keep walking. A proud son of America will blow it up and keep nuking... so keep nuking but don't cum all over the please in ecstasy, these curtains are new!

good luck with whatever it is that you do with your time when you're not wasting others...

Huh? It's cool if you want to talk in all sorts of offbeat (and rather insulting) quotes.

I'm asking you for a straight answer. Either you send the rest of our deal and we continue as before, you cancel the deal and forward me cash to pay for return postage, or you cancel the deal, I send the cards back with my own money, and you get a neg ref.

What's it gonna be?

starslayer · Post by **starslayer** » Wed Aug 23, 2006 8:32 pm

Ok,LMAO!

So along with his lies and extortion, now he insults Americans and makes sexual references....

So now we know he's prejudiced, a pervert, and a liar.

Would anyone who's read about this guy now deal with him??

kturock · Post by **kturock** » Wed Aug 23, 2006 10:03 pm

hmm just a quick thought.. saying you're sending something and then changing it, is mail fraud...the deal was he sends up front, you pay upon receipt. just like columbia house, bmg music, and a myriad of other mail order places. shipping half an order reeks of fraud.

titan136 · Post by **titan136** » Thu Aug 24, 2006 1:10 am

And not to get side tracked or anything but this dude is wierd too...=\

Doesn't even seem like you need to leave neg refs....anyone who reads this thread will be turned off for trading with him

Alsiaie · Post by **Alsiaie** » Thu Aug 24, 2006 2:40 am

I too have a personal Don't Trade list.

( 108 ) · Post by **Linrandir** » Thu Aug 24, 2006 12:28 pm

Yeah, this guy has clearly taken the 'if you can't dazzle them with brilliance baffle them with BS" concept to heart. At this point...personally I'd leave a bad trader reference and a bad trader report. People need to know not to deal with him.

ancientsociety · Post by **ancientsociety** » Thu Aug 24, 2006 12:57 pm

Negative ref left and bad trader report filed.

I hope he doesn't leave me a bad ref.....

Bartertown.com

HELP! Half my trade is being ransomed!

HELP! Half my trade is being ransomed!

IMO