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Creating a reputation

For general questions, rule questions, trade advice, FAQ's, and other assistance-related matters. This forum is for Bartertown related questions/help ONLY.

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Mugorn ( 8 )
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Creating a reputation

Post by Mugorn » Mon Dec 08, 2014 6:34 pm

Hello,

I was curious as to how to create a good reputation and get good feedback/rating here on this site.

I stumbled on this site about two months ago and have since bought many items from sellers. I've paid upfront via paypal as soon as the deal is made (I'm logged on my computer anyway). I love this site and I'll be trading here a lot as I am a big tabletop gamer.

However, some people are not selling to me because I do not have some kind of rating.

Should I be asking the people to leave me feedback/rating on the successful purchases I made? What other ways do I get a good rating here?

Thanks for your advice,

Cheers

pretre ( 842 )
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Re: Creating a reputation

Post by pretre » Mon Dec 08, 2014 6:55 pm

Yes, you should ask for feedback after a successful trade. It is how the site works. That's really how you get your rating up is to trade/buy/sell and get feedback.
People who owe me feedback: Readingrambo, steellegioncpt, Bigheaddan, Inigo Montoya, Mournafein,TheDean, Palados, Arthas367, gamma098, xSoulgrinderx x2, litsnsirn, noexit1982, Captaincortez, lafkak, Aelorien Darkthorn, clianez203, Hsivils, rwphillipsstl, prkeller, Close Seer, Jkilla, Keyoftwilight, proofyeq, voodoopainter.

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porkuslime ( 2896 )
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Re: Creating a reputation

Post by porkuslime » Mon Dec 08, 2014 8:08 pm

You earn +2 reputation (number in parentheses) for every Good Feedback you get, and earn (-10) for every Negative feedback you get.. so a rough rule of thumb is someones feedback score, divided by 2, is the number of trades they have done.

If you have had good results from your "two" months of activity, you should be hitting up your partners for Feedback, AND be diligent about leaving Feedback yourself.

I say "two" above, as your Join Date says Nov 6.. not Oct .. lol

Also.. can you take a moment to update your User Control Panel to reflect your real-world location? It really helps the site, and future trade partners out.

-P
2+2=5 for sufficiently large values of 2.

If you don't have your Location listed in your User Control Panel, why not take a second and update it? It will let your trading partners know where you are from the beginning.

I use the Unofficial Porkuslime Trading Guidelines - if you have way less refs.. you ship first.

Folks I am awaiting a ref from.. Zack

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FBI Internet Crime Complaint Center

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MagickalMemories ( 730 )
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Re: Creating a reputation

Post by MagickalMemories » Mon Dec 08, 2014 10:59 pm

Odd that you've bought many items but NOBODY has left you any references.
In your shoes, I would create a template PM with the basics:
"Hi. We completed a trade and I paid in advance. As a new member, getting my reference score is very important. Would you please take a moment and leave a reference for me? I'll gladly do the same for you.
As a reminder, my name is ********* and my purchase was $XX for ************.
Thanks for your time!
[Sign it with your name]"
I'd copy & paste that message to everyone who has not left you a reference, filling in the details as appropriate.
If there's anyone who you already left a reference for, I'd replace "Would you please take a moment and leave a reference for me? I'll gladly do the same for you." with, "I left you a reference on XX/XX/XX. I'd really appreciate it if you'd take a few moments and do the same for me."

I hope that helps.

Eric
Lower rating? You ship first.

Give me a sense of humor Lord. Give me the grace to see a joke.
To get some humor out of life and pass it on to other folk.


I think what this situation needs is some imagination.

"...I'm a nerd, and I'm here tonight to stand up for the rights of other nerds.” – Gilbert Lowell

Want my help with a BTR or backout? All messages sent/posted should be in CHRONOLOGICAL order. Otherwise, I just won't read it.

Hero Jones ( 70 )
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Re: Creating a reputation

Post by Hero Jones » Mon Dec 15, 2014 7:14 pm

I too recently had a transaction that was completed, but have yet to receive a reference. I paid promptly and even left a reference first. A good one of course. And then used your above example in a message to him. Not to mention I have asked a few times politely for a reference. I know he has seen the messages, I'm just confused as to why I am not getting a reference from him. I posted my reference to him on: 12-02-14, and as you can tell, I need to get my rep. up as well.

Thought it was relevant to post here and not start a new thread. Thanks!

HJ

Scarapis ( 0 )
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Re: Creating a reputation

Post by Scarapis » Mon Dec 15, 2014 7:32 pm

Well maybe the Reputation counter should be set that, even though one party has left feedback, neither party gets feedback till both parties have left feedback.

pretre ( 842 )
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Re: Creating a reputation

Post by pretre » Mon Dec 15, 2014 7:38 pm

Scarapis wrote:Well maybe the Reputation counter should be set that, even though one party has left feedback, neither party gets feedback till both parties have left feedback.
Ugh, no thanks.
People who owe me feedback: Readingrambo, steellegioncpt, Bigheaddan, Inigo Montoya, Mournafein,TheDean, Palados, Arthas367, gamma098, xSoulgrinderx x2, litsnsirn, noexit1982, Captaincortez, lafkak, Aelorien Darkthorn, clianez203, Hsivils, rwphillipsstl, prkeller, Close Seer, Jkilla, Keyoftwilight, proofyeq, voodoopainter.

Scarapis ( 0 )
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Re: Creating a reputation

Post by Scarapis » Mon Dec 15, 2014 7:48 pm

pretre wrote:
Scarapis wrote:Well maybe the Reputation counter should be set that, even though one party has left feedback, neither party gets feedback till both parties have left feedback.
Ugh, no thanks.

it would be fair this way since neither party gets rep unless both parties leave it, since as it goes right now, you could have some serious lazy rep leavers who are raking in the rep but leaving none, does that sound fair?

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MagickalMemories ( 730 )
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Re: Creating a reputation

Post by MagickalMemories » Mon Dec 15, 2014 7:51 pm

Hero Jones wrote:I too recently had a transaction that was completed, but have yet to receive a reference. I paid promptly and even left a reference first. A good one of course. And then used your above example in a message to him. Not to mention I have asked a few times politely for a reference. I know he has seen the messages, I'm just confused as to why I am not getting a reference from him. I posted my reference to him on: 12-02-14, and as you can tell, I need to get my rep. up as well.

Thought it was relevant to post here and not start a new thread. Thanks!

HJ
Maybe you're going about it the wrong way?
Instead of asking him to leave you a reference, ask him why he isn't. Sometimes, they don't think you earned a positive, but don't want to hit you with a negative, either (and, although it's worth 0 points, some people see a neutral reference early in your trading as a bad sign). Other times, they're just *one of those people* who doesn't leave references.
Subject line: Please, help me become a better trader
Message:
Hi.
We completed a trade on DD/MM/YY. I left you a reference on DD/MM/YY and have asked you a few times to do the same for me. I see you've read the PMs, but I still haven't received a reference.

I'm not trying to start an argument with you. As a more experienced trader, I'm asking you for help. Will you PLEASE tell me why you have not left one? If there is something I've done that makes you feel that I don't deserve a positive, but don't really deserve a negative, either, I would really like to know what that is. I want to be a good trader and valuable member of Bartertown. if I screwed something up, I'd like to know.
I won't take offense at anything you say to help me. If I screwed up, I'll own up to my mistake. At this point, though, I just don't know if I did or not.

If, on the other hand, you just don't leave references, I'd like to know that, as well. That way, I'll know it wasn't something I did wrong, and I won't have to wonder.
Thanks for your time.
{Sender's Name Here]
I can't guarantee you'll get a response, but it could help.

Please, keep in mind that leaving references is 100% optional. Although it's frowned upon NOT to do so, the fact is that we do not require it.

Scarapis wrote:Well maybe the Reputation counter should be set that, even though one party has left feedback, neither party gets feedback till both parties have left feedback.
Nope. Not happening. Leaving references is optional. Always has been. Always will be.

If you want to guarantee that (a) you'll get a reference or (b) have a route of recourse for not receiving one, write it into your trade negotiations.
"We agree that we will leave references for each other at the completion of our trade."
You could even add a further specification that the person who SENDS first RECEIVES the first reference.
That way, if they agree to the trade and reneg on the reference, they have done two things:
1) They have given you the ability to ask an Admin to remove the reference they have left for you (and we WILL)
2) They also open themselves up to a negative reference from you for not following through with part of the trade agreement (which I would support, provided you gave them a week or more to leave one, at least 2 notices, and can prove that they read the PMs).
The second part is pretty extreme, but such is the potential penalty for violating a trade agreement.
Scarapis wrote:it would be fair this way since neither party gets rep unless both parties leave it, since as it goes right now, you could have some serious lazy rep leavers who are raking in the rep but leaving none, does that sound fair?
Fair or not does not matter. It is a part of the rules and, as such, is something we all have to learn to deal with.
Making references a requirement as a site rule is something we simply will not do.

Eric
Lower rating? You ship first.

Give me a sense of humor Lord. Give me the grace to see a joke.
To get some humor out of life and pass it on to other folk.


I think what this situation needs is some imagination.

"...I'm a nerd, and I'm here tonight to stand up for the rights of other nerds.” – Gilbert Lowell

Want my help with a BTR or backout? All messages sent/posted should be in CHRONOLOGICAL order. Otherwise, I just won't read it.

Scarapis ( 0 )
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Joined: Tue Nov 25, 2014 4:15 pm
Location: Stockton, Ca.

Re: Creating a reputation

Post by Scarapis » Mon Dec 15, 2014 7:54 pm

MagickalMemories wrote:
Hero Jones wrote:I too recently had a transaction that was completed, but have yet to receive a reference. I paid promptly and even left a reference first. A good one of course. And then used your above example in a message to him. Not to mention I have asked a few times politely for a reference. I know he has seen the messages, I'm just confused as to why I am not getting a reference from him. I posted my reference to him on: 12-02-14, and as you can tell, I need to get my rep. up as well.

Thought it was relevant to post here and not start a new thread. Thanks!

HJ
Maybe you're going about it the wrong way?
Instead of asking him to leave you a reference, ask him why he isn't. Sometimes, they don't think you earned a positive, but don't want to hit you with a negative, either (and, although it's worth 0 points, some people see a neutral reference early in your trading as a bad sign). Other times, they're just *one of those people* who doesn't leave references.
Subject line: Please, help me become a better trader
Message:
Hi.
We completed a trade on DD/MM/YY. I left you a reference on DD/MM/YY and have asked you a few times to do the same for me. I see you've read the PMs, but I still haven't received a reference.

I'm not trying to start an argument with you. As a more experienced trader, I'm asking you for help. Will you PLEASE tell me why you have not left one? If there is something I've done that makes you feel that I don't deserve a positive, but don't really deserve a negative, either, I would really like to know what that is. I want to be a good trader and valuable member of Bartertown. if I screwed something up, I'd like to know.
I won't take offense at anything you say to help me. If I screwed up, I'll own up to my mistake. At this point, though, I just don't know if I did or not.

If, on the other hand, you just don't leave references, I'd like to know that, as well. That way, I'll know it wasn't something I did wrong, and I won't have to wonder.
Thanks for your time.
{Sender's Name Here]
I can't guarantee you'll get a response, but it could help.

Please, keep in mind that leaving references is 100% optional. Although it's frowned upon NOT to do so, the fact is that we do not require it.

Scarapis wrote:Well maybe the Reputation counter should be set that, even though one party has left feedback, neither party gets feedback till both parties have left feedback.
Nope. Not happening. Leaving references is optional. Always has been. Always will be.

If you want to guarantee that (a) you'll get a reference or (b) have a route of recourse for not receiving one, write it into your trade negotiations.
"We agree that we will leave references for each other at the completion of our trade."
You could even add a further specification that the person who SENDS first RECEIVES the first reference.
That way, if they agree to the trade and reneg on the reference, they have done two things:
1) They have given you the ability to ask an Admin to remove the reference they have left for you (and we WILL)
2) They also open themselves up to a negative reference from you for not following through with part of the trade agreement (which I would support, provided you gave them a week or more to leave one, at least 2 notices, and can prove that they read the PMs).
The second part is pretty extreme, but such is the potential penalty for violating a trade agreement.
Scarapis wrote:it would be fair this way since neither party gets rep unless both parties leave it, since as it goes right now, you could have some serious lazy rep leavers who are raking in the rep but leaving none, does that sound fair?
Fair or not does not matter. It is a part of the rules and, as such, is something we all have to learn to deal with.
Making references a requirement as a site rule is something we simply will not do.

Eric

then how about a separate counter for rep left then? this way if I do a trade I can see whether the person i'm trading with has left rep if ever, and if not I won't be so inclined to do so either, since it would be a waste of my time.

pretre ( 842 )
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Re: Creating a reputation

Post by pretre » Mon Dec 15, 2014 7:56 pm

Ugh. Why would you only leave feedback with the purpose of getting feedback? It isn't a transaction; it is a courtesy to others on the site so they know who they are dealing with.
People who owe me feedback: Readingrambo, steellegioncpt, Bigheaddan, Inigo Montoya, Mournafein,TheDean, Palados, Arthas367, gamma098, xSoulgrinderx x2, litsnsirn, noexit1982, Captaincortez, lafkak, Aelorien Darkthorn, clianez203, Hsivils, rwphillipsstl, prkeller, Close Seer, Jkilla, Keyoftwilight, proofyeq, voodoopainter.

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s_o_r_r_o_w ( 312 )
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Re: Creating a reputation

Post by s_o_r_r_o_w » Mon Dec 15, 2014 8:05 pm

pretre wrote:Ugh. Why would you only leave feedback with the purpose of getting feedback? It isn't a transaction; it is a courtesy to others on the site so they know who they are dealing with.
His reasons seem pretty clear to me. :)

It's very annoying, especially for new traders, when trade partners don't leave refs. I'm guilty of it, though I try to be conscientious.

MM's advice is the way to go; if you want to see if a trader leaves refs, look ad theirs and click on those who left refs.
I am always in the market for weird and wonderful GW oddbitz and ephemera. PM me if you have something old/weird/rare.

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Scarapis ( 0 )
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Re: Creating a reputation

Post by Scarapis » Mon Dec 15, 2014 8:08 pm

pretre wrote:Ugh. Why would you only leave feedback with the purpose of getting feedback? It isn't a transaction; it is a courtesy to others on the site so they know who they are dealing with.

and yet if a new trader here has a string of traders who leave them no rep, then how is someone to distinguish if a new trader is a good risk to trade with? even though they may have a dozen good trades under their belt but no rep left, and like MM said if no rep is left that is just as good as nothing, which can be construed as a neg too.

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s_o_r_r_o_w ( 312 )
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Re: Creating a reputation

Post by s_o_r_r_o_w » Mon Dec 15, 2014 8:33 pm

Scarapis wrote: and yet if a new trader here has a string of traders who leave them no rep, then how is someone to distinguish if a new trader is a good risk to trade with? even though they may have a dozen good trades under their belt but no rep left, and like MM said if no rep is left that is just as good as nothing, which can be construed as a neg too.
A dozen seems like either extraordinarily bad luck--or a potential problem.

If 12 traders do not respond to your request for a ref--frankly, the problem might be you.
I am always in the market for weird and wonderful GW oddbitz and ephemera. PM me if you have something old/weird/rare.

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No Finecast, please.
-----
READ THE RULES!
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Tips on shipping to Canada
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MagickalMemories ( 730 )
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Re: Creating a reputation

Post by MagickalMemories » Mon Dec 15, 2014 10:23 pm

Sorrow is dead on about that. If you have two or more people not leave you references in a row -especially if they are established traders- you should start looking inwards for the problem... and BEG them to give you feedback, even if only privately, on what you did wrong.

I didn't say that not getting a ref is the same as getting a negative. Not at all. I said some people will see a NEUTRAL on a new trader as being a bad sign. There's a difference.

Frankly, Scarapis, we won't be installing a counter as you suggest and, frankly, you should not want one.
If I see someone who has left, say, 50 references but has only received 40 in return, I am going to wonder why 20% of their trading partners chose not to leave a reference (per my explanation above). It will make me more hesitant to trade with them and FAR less likely to want to ship or pay first, regardless of their ref score.

Although we rely heavily on a reference score here, and encourage everyone to use it, it is -as I said- optional. As such, Bartertown will not do anything to require it in any way (including the holding hostage of references left for a trader until he reciprocates) or to measure the # of references left vs. received. The reference measurement style, methods and ratio that we have in place -and have had in place since 1996) have served us well for 18 years with only ONE change (neutrals were, at one point, worth a single point, rather than none). There is no good reason for us to change things now.

Eric
Lower rating? You ship first.

Give me a sense of humor Lord. Give me the grace to see a joke.
To get some humor out of life and pass it on to other folk.


I think what this situation needs is some imagination.

"...I'm a nerd, and I'm here tonight to stand up for the rights of other nerds.” – Gilbert Lowell

Want my help with a BTR or backout? All messages sent/posted should be in CHRONOLOGICAL order. Otherwise, I just won't read it.

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